Written by Wenger Boy on Monday, 14 March 2011 15:09

Arsenal fans are a fickle bunch it must be said. The wave of optimism before the Carling Cup final has almost completely subsided now and this Arsenal team have, in the minds of many supporters, gone from being potential greats to actual flops. Where they were cheered yesterday they are booed today and where there were once songs sung there are now axes swung. While it’s understandable to a degree it’s all fairly predictable and I could have told you this would happen if we lost a long, long time before we actually did.

The most depressing facet of this fickleness is the whole ‘Wenger out’ nonsense. It’s been covered a fiznillion times (a number so big I had to invent it specifically for this sentence) but I just want to go over it once more to try and shed some light on why you might have arrived at this conclusion and why, when looking at this reason, it becomes evident that this viewpoint is fundamentally flawed and in need of some serious perspective.

People who come to this site may mistake my positivity for blind faith but let me tell you that I am not content with the situation as it is. I wouldn’t be a supporter of Arsenal Football Club if I didn’t think we should be winning things and as someone who is yet to see my beloved team win anything at all I am arguably more desperate than any of you to see our captain hoist a gleaming trophy high above his head. However, having said that I retain my right to be see things in the best light possible and while I believe fully in criticising Wenger or the players when they deserve it I also feel it is my duty as a blogger to instil some belief in a team that is still fighting for something this season. 

How can you expect the players to pick themselves up and fight for the title when you are already writing them off? Your mentality is more fragile than theirs and I certainly wouldn’t want you anywhere near the team during the run in. 

The ultimate problem is one I feel has already been expressed best by Mr Wenger himself. When fans booed the team after a 1-1 draw with Middlesbrough in 1998 he uttered the now famous sentence: “If you eat caviar every day it's difficult to return to sausages”, and that still rings true to this day. The situation back then was different of course – we’d recently completed a famous double – but what is interesting is that even at that point Arsenal supporters were showing a worrying tendency to turn on the team when things didn’t go their way. 

The trouble now of course is that we’ve been eating sausages for a hell of a long time and people are craving that caviar like never before. The taste of sturgeon eggs is slowly fading from their memory and every time they try to order it the waiter comes back with a couple of bangers instead. No matter how good the sausages taste they will never quite be caviar and as a result a whole lot of people want to get rid of the head chef in the hope that someone else might be able to cook up the tasty delicacies that they desire.

But the sausages we’ve been eating haven’t actually been that bad, have they? Sure the quality has fluctuated but at times they have been pretty damn scrumptious and we’ve gobbled them up by the bucket load without a second thought. And let’s just say for one second that we did bring in a new chef and it was only after he started that we realised our kitchen didn’t even have the ingredients for sausages or caviar and we were forced to eat tripe for the foreseeable future. It was only because our previous chef had somehow managed to make tasty sausages out of old Fairy washing up liquid bottles that we had been eating as well as we had all these years. Imagine that. Then we’d be screwed, wouldn’t we?

Having stretched out the analogy like a thief on a medieval rack let’s revisit the important points implicit in that jumble of culinary nonsense in order to make them a little clearer to all.

The main issue here is that Arsenal fans expect way, way too much. We’ve only recently emerged from our most successful period ever and on the back of that anything else is bound to seem like failure. When you win and win and then become a nearly team then it’s somewhat natural to feel like there’s something fundamentally wrong and it is this more than anything which leads so many supporters to call for Wenger’s head every time something bad happens. 

But how many of these same fans were critical of Newcastle for sacking Chris Hughton or West Brom for sacking Roberto Di Matteo part way through their first proper crack at the top division? These are managers who raised expectations and then when results didn’t go their way they were ruthlessly axed like so many unfortunates before them. They were victims of their own success and had both narrowly missed out on promotion through the play-offs they may well still be in their jobs today. 

Now you may say that these are completely different cases since these managers weren’t given time whereas Wenger has been given ages and ages and ages and ages. To that I just laugh and say “You, my friend, have been brainwashed”. Brainwashed by previous success and brainwashed by the media into thinking that six years without a trophy is a long time. It’s not, it’s six measly years. Six years, I might add, in which we’ve been to a Champion’s League final, beaten the best team of the last decade and consistently fought on four fronts with a wide range of exciting, quality players. Six years in which hundreds of other teams have also not won trophies or indeed even come close to winning trophies and in which smaller teams have become stronger and stronger teams have become weaker. We may not have won anything but we haven’t fallen off either and to be honest we can all afford to wait just a little longer in my book. 

Winning only one trophy and no titles between 1970-71 and 1986-87, that’s a pretty long time. Not winning the title at all since 1960-61, that’s a really, really long time. We’re not even close to that yet.

And while Wenger has been a victim of his own success in the long run he has also been a victim of his own success in the short run too. Back at the beginning of the season we were tipped - as we always are but never do - to fall out of the top four and begin our steady decline to mediocrity, even by some Arsenal supporters. Instead of that we have been to a final, been knocked out of one competition at the Nou Camp and of another, at the quarter-final stage, at Old Trafford – stadia in which losing is not considered by many to be a shameful act - and most importantly we are one of only two teams left in the whole of England with any realistic chance of winning the most prized domestic trophy of them all. It’s safe to say we’re doing a whole lot better than expected. 

To put that into perspective we have done better than Man U, Chelsea, Sp*rs, City and Liverpool in the Carling Cup, better than Chelsea, Sp*rs and Liverpool in the F.A. Cup, better than City and Liverpool in the Champion’s League and better than Chelsea, City, Sp*rs and Liverpool in the league. We’ve done better than every big team in at least one competition and there is not one competition we haven’t done better than at least two of them.

But Wenger should have really been more careful. Instead of allowing us to fall off the radar he decided to put us directly in the public eye by actually doing his best to win something with the club. He really does like making a rod for his own back. 

Since it is because of our success and not because of our failure that we are all feeling quite so down right now. Had we gone out of the Carling Cup to Birmingham in September and lost to Man U in the F.A. Cup in January then second place in the league with a game in hand at this stage of the season would seem to be something to celebrate. The other cups would have been forgotten about by now and we would be focussing all of our efforts on winning the one thing left to win instead of spouting our mouths off about the three things we no longer can. And if our exits hadn’t been in such close proximity then it wouldn’t seem like a ‘collapse’, it’s only because they happened so soon after each other that everyone is talking like there’s a huge, unsolvable problem. But those were three very difficult, easy to lose games that in isolation wouldn’t seem so reflective of a wider issue.

Is there a problem? Yes. Is it unsolvable with Wenger in charge? No. Would we have even done as well as we have with someone else at the helm? No-one can know. But you can’t say we are doing badly and you can’t say we will never win. That we even came so close should be taken as a positive and not negative. And we’re not done yet. 

Did we do better than last season? Yes. Much better. So that’s already an improvement and this season isn’t over yet. If we finish fifth next season and go out of everything before February then you might be able say something fundamental has to change but as we’ve improved a lot I’m afraid you don’t really have a leg to stand on. And that’s forgetting that we’ve been in a similar position before (2008-09) and come back to where we are now so that just proves you can never write us off under Wenger. 

Remember that you’re as disappointed as you are now because we came so close and lost, not because we didn’t come close at all. One mistake, one mistaken red card and a lack of clinical finishing in one game is very possibly all that separate us from a victory over Barcelona, a semi-final and a trophy. That’s how tight it is at this level.

Fickle fans see everything in black and white when our situation is really the greyest it can be. If we win the league on goal difference we will be amazing and if we lose it on goal difference we will be a shambles. That such a fine line separates the two should serve to highlight the absurdity of that view. 

Yes, the Arsenal team of 2010-11 is not the Invincibles but if this was the 2005-06 season and we had won something the year before then no-one would be calling for Wenger’s head. It’s not this season that’s the problem, it’s the history. This season on its own has been pretty good but we are being unfairly weighed down by years of expectation without results.

But the Arsenal team of 2010-11 is also not the team that lost the Champion’s League final in 2006 or the one that threw away the league in 2007-08. This is a new team with new players and it’s doing pretty damn well in my book. The best thing we can do right is to give this team the backing it has earned by playing some wonderful football at times and staying competitive on four fronts against some of the best teams the world has to offer.

Please, please stop with the doom and gloom. It’s not that bad here. Really.

Earlier I talked about the unfair sackings of Hughton and Di Matteo but luckily for those clubs f you want to stay around mid-table there are a fair few journeyman, mediocre managers doing the rounds you can call on. But when you’re fighting on a budget for four trophies at a club with a certain ethic and philosophy it becomes a whole more difficult than just wedging in a successor.

With that in mind I have question for those that see replacing Wenger as the best option:

Would you risk your sausages for the sake of caviar, knowing that you might well end up with neither?

I wouldn’t. And I don’t think we’ll be eating sausages for much longer. 

WB

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Comments (66)

• 14-Mar-2011 15:19 | | keeming  - we haven't been eating cavier for a long long whil
  

  Arsenal and beautiful football is a mis-association these days. Whereas our football used to rapier quick counter attacking, now its tediously passing around with little penetration in the last third. And when our dumb and dumber duo - Diaby and Dennilson - plays, watching Arsenal becomes downright unpalatable at times...

• 14-Mar-2011 15:27 | | What Caviar?  - Sausages
  

  I like sausages, but Wenger can't cook them.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:27 | | okayplayer  - Inconvenient truth
  

  I like how you conveniently gloss over the losses in the CC final and a 3rd string United side in the FA cup.
  
  We knew TV5 would be out long term and had a chance to strengthen in the jan transfer window. He didn't, and we are now looking at Squid-kos partnership in the most vital stage of the campaign
  
  Last season, RVP10 and NB52 were out and we had a chance to sign a striker, we opted to wait for a free transfer.
  
  These are the margins that win or lose you trophies.
  
  AW is payed £6m a year to make those decisions. That's a lot of money.
  
  The club is raising the ticket prices 6% to accomodate his wage increase.
  
  We'll see. Judgment day is coming closer

• 14-Mar-2011 15:28 | | Wenger Boy
  

  But we weren't eating caviar before Wenger came in so why do people think we'd eat it again if he left?
  
  He's the one who got us playing that way. He's the one who brought the Invincible era. He's the one who's got us within ten games of a title this season.
  
  We're not perfect, none of the top teams are. But we've got a hell of a lot to be positive about. Diaby and Denilson may not be a midfield combination to shout about but Cesc, Song and Wilshere is. Ramsey too. We are at most two players and a little bit of luck away from sustained succcess.
  
  How many teams would kill to be in our position?
  
  If we win the title then are you going to come to this blog and say the same thing? No. Will you be complaining about Diaby and Denilson then? No.
  
  The Invincibles is a feat that will probably never be repeated in our lifetime. We had it too good for too long and now people have lost their perspective.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:32 | | Ganesh  - Bad sausages at that
  

  The Carling Cup final was winnable. Why didn't we win it? Lack of nerves. No one turned up other than van Persie. Even that would have been enough to sate the restless Arsenal fans that you speak about. Agreed, Barcelona and Manchester United beat us because of a refereeing decision and the heartache of a European exit respectively, but Birmingham too? Aren't we the same team that beat them 3-0 in their own park?
  
  Did you really think Arsenal would have won against Sunderland after fielding a midfield that consisted of Denilson and Diaby? Song's more defensive and attacking than Denilson in my honest opinion. Diaby slows the pace of the game too much for the opposition to get time to think. Bendtner doesn't stand up to the challenge when called upon. I've lost count of how many times Denilson lost his footing or gave the ball away against Manchester United. He was supposed to be the one shielding the defense. When United attacked 3 players were enough to cause our exposed defense problems; when Arsenal attacked in hordes, they still weren't enough.
  
  And United were crying out for a decent CM; their reserves dominated our midfield. It seems like mediocre players are finding it easy to nail down a first team place at Arsenal.
  
  If players like Denilson continue at Arsenal next season, then there's absolutely no caviar forthcoming.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:34 | | Ganesh
  

  We haven't won a single premiership game where Denilson has started, so there you go. I won't be thankful to him even if we win the league.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:35 | | Ganesh
  

  I obviously meant this season's league.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:36 | | Wenger Boy
  

  I didn't gloss over anything. I mentioned the final loss and the United loss more than once. Perhaps you didn't read the article?
  
  Of course it's obviously Wenger's fault that Djourou and Sczszney both suffered dislocations in back-to-back matches, or that TV5 suffered unforseen setbacks.
  
  And who signed RVP10, NB52, TV5, Djourou, Sczszeny and the rest of them in the first place?
  
  He doesn't get everything right but neither does anyone. If just a couple of things had gone our way this season - an offside, a goal, a return from injury - we would have won where we'd lost and you'd be full of praise for him right now. That's a fact.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:43 | | Wenger Boy
  

  Diaby, Denilson, Bendtner. I sense a similar theme here.
  
  "It seems like mediocre players are finding it easy to nail down a first team place at Arsenal."
  
  None of those players are in our first team. Diaby and Denilson are only playing because of injuries.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:54 | | dan
  

  they are first team players, there is no such thing as fierst 11 players only. they play between 20 nad 30 games a year, thert are clearly firts team players.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:55 | | dan
  

  one injury to song and denilson is a starter, how can anyone deny that?
  we aren't good enough full stop, seen it all before and it won't chnage until the manager leaves, which sadly is not happeneing anytime soon.

• 14-Mar-2011 15:56 | | Wenger Boy
  

  Ever? I think that's a falsity. Denilson is not the best player this club has had but he's certainly not the worst. He's also suffering from a little thing called lack of form which effects everyone from time to time.
  
  When Van Persie came back after injury everyone knew how good he was so they gave him time. But it took an extended run in the team to bring back his form.
  
  We can't always expect bench warmers to be game changers.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:01 | | MeanLean
  

  A fantastic piece of writing yet again from Wenger Boy and I agree totally. You make so many good points that have been completely ignored.
  
  To those who want Wenger out, what happens when manager x comes in and does much worse? Or to put it a better way.
  
  "It was only because our previous chef had somehow managed to make tasty sausages out of old Fairy washing up liquid bottles that we had been eating as well as we had all these years. Imagine that. Then we’d be screwed, wouldn’t we? "
  
  This is the biggest problem with fans who want Arsene out. Many do not realise that it is his hard work that has got the club to this stage after the move. The reason why we have money to spend is due to his work in the transfer market. People are banging on about Wenger spending the money of world class big money signings need to understand that without Wenger we would not have the surplus.
  
  Another point I want to raise is this. We as fans want the players to fight until the end and give everything they have right? Why is this not the case for the supporters? If you really have the need to vent and blame Denilson and Diaby who were certainly not the reason for our defeat at the weekend just wait until the end of the season.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:09 | | dan
  

  why do fans think that if wenger leaves arsenal can't continue, it is such rubbish, we have been around way before him and will be after him, we are currently a top four team winning nothing, i find it impossible to belive that there is no other manager on earth that can take this squad of players plus the funds available and make them also a top 4 team never winning anything. what wenger is currently doing is no big deal, a few years ago i agree keeping us top four during the early emirates years was a great achievement, but now sorry he is doing nothing exceptional at all. it is time to move on as he will never change his ways. what some people don't realize is that the hate for diaby and denilson is because they embody everything that is wrong with arsenal, overpaid, lazy average footballers who show no passion and love for arsenal, compare that to jack, who besides being an amazing footballer is all heart, these guys simply don't care and play that way week in and week out, knowing that wenger will never get rid of them, that there 50k pay check is coming and that there is no one to replace them.
  
  it is as clear as anything.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:11 | | Wenger Boy
  

  Exactly ML, and thanks for the much needed support.
  
  People seem to have a very skewed opinion of what's happening at Arsenal and it's quite worrying in my eyes.
  
  The most apt phrase for those who want Wenger's head is I believe:
  
  "You don't know what you've got til it's gone."

• 14-Mar-2011 16:14 | | Wenger Boy
  

  But we're not a 'top four' team, are we? Right now we're top two and with a game in hand that would take us level.
  
  That doesn't quite tally with what you're saying I'm afraid.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:14 | | dan
  

  again what's gone? THEY WIN NOTHING, that is the idea of football, to win!!! the quality of the football is also so blown out of proportion, most games are average at best, please give 5 examples of great footballing performances this year? when push comes to shove against good teams they consistantly fail and that is a fact not an opinion, the results show that.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:19 | | dan
  

  we won't end up in the top two, thankfully we are far enough ahead of spurs to blow top four but won't end up top two. obviously we will know that in may, but let's get real, with the injuries we have and the quality of the back up currently playing, do you really believe we are going to win the majority of games left, come on really?
  
  when you see the same thing happeneing again and again it is hard to change your opinion, we all knew we would lose to barca and uitd, was utterly obvious as it is that we will never win the league.
  
  the biormingham was the real killer, win that and 3rd and would have been a good season, but will end with another if only season!! and for many that is good enough and for some it isn't depends on where you come down in that argument. but don't kid yourself that we are the best team in england, you are kidding yourself

• 14-Mar-2011 16:19 | | MeanLean
  

  Of course Arsenal will be Arsenal without Wenger, that is obvious. The question is, can another manager do the same job as Wenger and achieve what he has managed on his budget?
  
  Can you name one manager who has remained in the CL and fighting for league on the same financial restraints. After you try our domestic league, try further out and see what you get back.
  
  We can pretend that manager x or y will come in and spend billions on players but that will just not happen. ARSENAL do not spend over the odds on players, not Wenger. The narrative is that Wenger is holding us back from spending money and without him Jose Moan-riniho will come in and buy two £50 mil players in every position. It won't happen.
  
  The reason why we are so well known around the world nowadays is because Wenger has built the club up to where it is today.
  
  If someone can argue that another manager can achieve more against teams who spend their clubs into debt or against rich sugar daddies as well as play the attacking football that I for one, would never like to see leave then bring him in. I am all for it. Let Arsene go upstairs and put his feet up.
  
  But where are the facts? Where is the evidence that ONE other manager has the same record as our manager? Until then, he and his young (improving) squad can stay put.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:27 | | w12mcee
  

  wenger leaves= players leave = a team taking even more years to rebuild. the new manager would probably not make the top four. get sacked then we'll have a new manager every other season. how people think wenger leaving would help beats me, unless we have a man city/chelsea situation and we spend 100's of millions. no thanks.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:28 | | MeanLean
  

  Dan,
  
  Would you want the players to have your current mindset?

• 14-Mar-2011 16:28 | | dan
  

  you don't need to spend silly money to bring in good quality players who can improve the team. i personally believe it isn't just bringing players in, in which he is failing, his tactics, team selections and substitutions are so poor, that i think even non galmorous managers like coyle and moyes would tactically do better than him. just look at the last few weeks and some of his decisions. Rosicky in the CC final, denislon and diaby in both sunderland and man utd?, not using nasrin in the middle for all games when cesc is out? moving jack forward against sunderland, playing cesc against barca, not bring bendtner or chamakh on after rvp was sent off. the list goes on and and on all year long, taking off walcott against newcastle and bringing on eboue, etc etc, you could give example in almnost every game we play, he seems utterly clueless and these poor decisons have material impacts on agame after game.
  
  i think the club needs a new direction and not with him upstairs we need a clean break.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:30 | | dan
  

  they play with that current mind set already, they look defeated before they start, the believe is totally gone, how can you deny that, just watch them play, there is no fight, no passion just an acceptance of their fate. was watching seville vs barca yesterday, the passion and fight showed by seville players was unreal and they got a result, we showed nothing and got nothing.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:31 | | MeanLean
  

  *Points at w12mcee*
  
  Exactly!

• 14-Mar-2011 16:32 | | MeanLean
  

  But Dan you are talking like we are West Brom.
  
  Say what you like about the league being weaker etc etc We are 3 points off the top in March with a game in hand.
  
  Are we really that bad or far off?

• 14-Mar-2011 16:33 | | Wenger Boy
  

  Twenty comments in and we get the first sense of perspective from someone outside the blog.
  
  Thank you for your words of sense. They are needed now more than ever.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:34 | | dan
  

  you make wenger bigger than the club and that in summary is everything that is currently wrong at arsenal, from the board on down, webger leaves we suddenly become rubbish, doesn't happen anywhere else why should it happen at us? are we such a second rate club that the manager changes and we are done? can't we attract a decent manager anymore, doesn't the lure of such a big and amazing club mean anything? you are more depressing than me. i belive we can attract the best, we are the biggest and best club in london, huge stadium, massive fan base, amazing history, some great young players. if cesc wants to leave becuase wenger does so be it, he wants to leave anyway. you should have some faith in arsenal football club!!!!

• 14-Mar-2011 16:37 | | Wenger Boy
  

  Mate, against Man U we created a hatful of chances and it was only our finishing which let us down.
  
  Conceding on the other hand was down to our defence - a defence which has conceded less than Man U in the league and has rightly been praised for doing so.
  
  I saw a lot of fight in the team but without key players fit or in form we didn't quite have the cutting edge to pull it off. Their keeper was man of the match which said it all really.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:40 | | dan
  

  we are obviously not that bad, the question is can we take the next step to start winning things again and the answer at the moment seems to be a big fat no. the same things happen year in and year out, why do you think things are going to change and what do you think is going to change? suddenly our injury prone players will suddenly not miss half of every season, suddenly the denilson, diaby's eboue's rosicky's, bendtners', squliacci's vela's of the world are going to be able to put in the required performances to back up the first 11, suddenly we are going to be able to defend set plays, suddenly we are going to have B game plan when a doesn't work. the list goes on and on. NOTHING has changed in the past few years and no doubt we will end up 3rd or 4th and say if only any of the above wouldn't have occurred.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:41 | | MeanLean
  

  No no no, Wenger is not bigger than Arsenal. Of course not. But the reason why I do not want him to go anywhere is because he gives us the chance to be the best we can be.
  
  I have been a supporter way before Wenger joined the club. I have seen us improve both on and off the pitch in that time.
  
  Look at Tottenham, Liverpool, Villa and all the other clubs who thought they could spend vast sums and get a new manager. They have failed to get anywhere near to us.
  
  I really do not understand the whole Denilson, Diaby thing. I happen to like both players, they have their own strengths and once match sharp are good players.
  
  At present they are second string players due to the quality of our first choice 11. From what I read it seems as if Manchester United have 4 Rooney's 5 Nani's and Chelsea have 4 Terry's 5 Lampards.
  
  Every club has a pecking order, every club have a range of quality. That will never change. You cannot expect Arsenal to have 3 world class players who are perfect in every way in every single position. I don't get it.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:42 | | MeanLean
  

  Right guys, I am off home.
  
  Dan, as much as we disagree, it is nice that we can debate without some of the abuse that comes with disagreement.
  
  Laters all.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:43 | | dan
  

  sometimes in life you have to look outside the box, and you like so many in the club are scared to do that and are prepared to accept being also rans, because that is what we are. maybe we can never be the best again due the financial constraints but i do think managers can make the best of the players they have and create winning teams. just look at utd, what a squad full of average players and look at what ferguson does with them.

• 14-Mar-2011 16:44 | | dan
  

  no abuse from me, we are all entitled to our own opinions.

• 14-Mar-2011 17:14 | | Danish Gooner  - Wenger
  

  Your frame of mind is exactly why we are so one dimensional on and off the football field.Do you really seriously believe that Arsenal will sink without a trace when Wenger is gone ???? Exactly the same was muttered when GG was sacked and in came Wenger.Wenger has become like a dictator,i just read that he want us to keep faith exactly the same bull he has been spouting over and over again for the last 5 or more seasons.Noone in their right frame of mind can seriously believe in these platitudes anymore,they are tired regurgitations of something that happens so often it has become an every day event.Wenger clearly have no idea on how to set his team up to actually achieve something season after season we have failed the lakmuss test and the guy gets paid a kings ransom not to spend the dough so the fat cats at board level can get fatter.Denilson,Rosicky,Diaby etc have been a part of Arsenal for so long without ever playing a half decent game it has become a joke.WENGER OUT !!!!!

• 14-Mar-2011 19:23 | | redboy  - we got to spend now
  

  how good would wenger be if he did spend money.hes got to get real and start now before we fall out of the top four for ever.wecant just keep trying to build teams when all the other clubs buy ready made players.we cant complete with that.i would like to know as wenger got money to spend or not if he as and will not spend he needs to go we need to know the truth.i for one would love him to stay but hes got to spend

• 14-Mar-2011 21:02 | | Man United Killa  - Nothiing wrong with consistency and improvement
  

  Maybe we werent eating much cavier before AW came but he is being paid make us Cavier.There aint nothing wrong with fans wanting a little consistency and show of heart.
  I guess I will agree with you to some extent that Wenger has done a good job but why ruin all the good work.Our game is getting too predictable and slow.We used to be the kings of counter attack but now what are we?A bunch of ......(am just not in the mood to use bad words)
  Though the players might be giving it their best shot,the fact remains that if you are not good enough,you are not good enough.
  In any case,he didnt cook the Cavier with his money.We,the fans played a role.All we are asking is for the club to show some ambition in terms of signing players and adjusting our style of play to match the Dynamics of football.Footy changes,managers watch,learn,plan and counter other managers hence the need to switch things around every now and then to throw opposition off.
  I wont sit here and act like signing palyers will change everything.That would be hypocritic and unrealistic.We need to learn from out mistakes,from better teams and even sometimes from teams that are well below us.some of these teams have good play plans..especially defensively.Our movement off the ball is diabolic.And guess what?that is one thing I sincerely wish we can learn from Barcelone.With our passing game,if we learn to move fast enough into the right places like Barca do, and also with the right players,we will be immortal.Its a shame Wenger cant see..or maybe he can but his experiment is not yet over!!Big Shame I must say!

• 14-Mar-2011 21:03 | | Man United Killa
  

  pardon my errors..didnt proof read.

• 14-Mar-2011 21:12 | | Man United Killa  - Changes!
  

  I am not for getting rid of Wenger.He is a good manager but if you say you dont know what you have till its gone,I might have to say that "when one door closes another opens but we stare at the closed one with so much regret that we dont notice that another door has opened."
  All we are saying is that he needs to change some of his policies.This 6 million-player policy is good as long as you have the right player but it sure wont work everyday in an ever changing football world.We have no leader in the team.

• 14-Mar-2011 21:14 | | Man United Killa
  

  They can all follow Wenger out if they want to.Their allegiance is to Arsenal not Wenger.If they have not figured that out,then maybe they should not be playing for Arsenal.Arsenal> Wenger NOT Wenger>Arsenal.
  I like Wenger but any player who wants to leave because Wenger leaves can do that now.Because guess what?One day Wenger will leave.He wont be manager forever!

• 14-Mar-2011 23:31 | | dkgooner
  

  None of us know what will happen the rest of the season. There are 2 possibilities - we either win the EPL or we don't. I've expressed my feeling that we are unlikely to do it, mainly because of the weakened state of the squad. But I could easily be wrong - I'm just going on what I'm seeing at this point in time. But there is nothing mathematically that says we can't win it. And who can gauge the effect on the confidence of the team (and on the title race) of a couple of wins?
  The time for discussing the merits or otherwise of manager and players is when the season is over. In the meantime, I will continue to give the squad my full support. (Even if I flip out once in a while!)
  dkg

• 15-Mar-2011 01:54 | | Man United Killa  - ok
  

  fair enough

• 15-Mar-2011 09:49 | | MeanLean
  

  Good morning all,
  
  It is a new day today. Jens has joined the playing staff and Djourou might be back quicker than we thought.
  
  A few more bits of good news and things may be brighter than we think.

• 15-Mar-2011 09:59 | | CHGoooner  - The tide has now turned
  

  interested to read the comments here as this has been consistently the most pro-Wenger site for years both in terms of its main contributors and editor and its readership. I have sensed a change in mood BEFORE the CC final loss and defeats to Barca and Man U as most fans saw the latter two coming at least and were apprehensive before Birmingham. However this has really hardened following these (almost inevitable it seems) reverses. However, when you read the comments on this site it really confirms my view that the 'minority' has actually become a majority. The biggest problem for Wenger is he can no longer trot out the excuses he used before (new stadium, no money, young team) and so uses injuries , bas luck etc. The reality as us sceptics have suggested was always the case, is that he has built a team with no real character, lacking in determination and fight. He is tactically inept and cannot or will not coach the defence. His transfer policy is far too weighted to overseas players with no Prem experience following earlier success when players suited to the Prem weren't already here (Vieira, Petit, Laurent etc....) and finally he lies to the media - and by extension the fans - about everuything from transfers to injuries to not seeing incidents.
  
  Sorry but he should have been removed three years ago in my view, it has just been a collosal waste of three years, but at least the bulk of our fans now see that it has to be the end of the road for Wenger if we really are to change the record and progress as a football team.

• 15-Mar-2011 10:09 | | MeanLean
  

  Whatever manager it is at whatever club it is. You have disgruntled supporters after every dropped point.
  
  I am sure you find Wolves supporters who come on the internet and complain if they drew away to Manchester City for example.
  
  "he reality as us sceptics have suggested was always the case, is that he has built a team with no real character, lacking in determination and fight. He is tactically inept and cannot or will not coach the defence"
  
  It is truly amazing that without all those ingredients we can go top of the league with a victory on the weekend. Imagine if we actually had all those things that you complain about. Surely if we are producing these results without apparent character, leadership etc then it may well be worth supporting just on the off chance that we manage to bring in someone who has?
  
  I obviously disagree with you and would suggest that we would not be (almost) top of the top league in the country if we did not have those qualities.

• 15-Mar-2011 10:13 | | MeanLean
  

  Are we actually talking about the right club here?
  
  You don't mean Liverpool who have spent loads and loads of money yet have never won the league and do not look like doing so for a long while yet.
  
  What about Money City who have pumped in record amounts in their club but are still searching to get to our level.
  
  What about the mighty Chelsea with their English gritty backbone that you yearn for. We were never supposed to beat them or be higher than them.
  
  But yeah, Wenger must go right? Sorry CH but I still cannot come to your way of thinking.
  
  While we are on the subject. Humour me for a second. I know you think we will implode and it is possible given the confidence of the squad right now/.
  
  But IF we manage to accumulate more points than the Mancs from now until May (10 games) and we win the title.. as I said just humour me.
  
  Would you still advocate Wenger being sacked come the end of the season and go a new direction?

• 15-Mar-2011 11:16 | | CHGoooner
  

  ML, you are a die hard Wenger loyalist. I admire your genuine belief in the guy to deliver what every single one of us wants - a winning team (not a 'nearly winning team that just misses out' by the way a REAL one. I don't believe he will or can any more. I also have a genuinely held view that without the bedrock he inherited NONE of his early success would or could have happened. His failure was to not understand how crucial those players were in shaping the quality and mentality of all the playing staff and it lasted until the departure of many of those initial players and the arrival of most of what we have now (between 04 and 06). The likes of Denilson would have hated Adms telling him he's a lazy loser, it might even have made him a decent player (not sure even TA could have achieved that, but you never know). He wasn't afraid to tell Bergkamp that his fancy touches were useless unless you put it to use in winning things. He and the other back four tore the likes of Vieira and Petit off a strip when they weren't doing their jobs properly.
  
  Wenger has tried to do it his way entirely and failed. Time to get another guy who can make the necessary changes without feeling that by doing so he will be admitting that he was wrong.
  
  That's why he should go. He has had 5 years to address the same old issues and 5 years he has failed to do so, which is why the same thinghs happen again and again and again.

• 15-Mar-2011 11:50 | | MeanLean
  

  I have to throw a spanner in the works there CH.
  
  Our best ever team was built 100% by Wenger and had none of Graham's players in it.
  
  You have gone from 04 to now without anything in between. Do you not think anything at all has happened to make Arsene go another way?

• 15-Mar-2011 12:07 | | MeanLean
  

  The thing is CHG, I understand your way of thinking. We had players who had won trophies before, had been there worn the t-shirt. We had fighters for the shirt, I understand that point.
  
  When thing are not going well then we do not always see that fight from the current crop.
  
  That is not always the case. Case in point Stoke away last season. There have been many more times since.
  
  But my point is this. It seems like you are arguing your point blindly. There has to be a reason why we are three points off the top with a game in hand. Will you be saying the same with 5 games left? How about 2 games left?
  
  If we lost the league on goal difference would Wenger still have to go? Or how about if we won on goal difference?
  The big picture is that we are making progress. We are in a position that none of our rivals are in. We have a future the others have to rebuild, reshape.
  
  You may think that it is doom and gloom but the reality suggests otherwise.

• 15-Mar-2011 14:00 | | dan
  

  we will only know if we have made real progress at the end of the season abnd where we finish in the league. however what is not in doubt is the poor quality of the league this year, chelsea and utd aren't a shdow of their former selves, city have pushed up there and it is still early for a whole new team built in one or two years. if you compare us to spurs over the past two years they have clearly gotten much closer to us.
  
  point is we will blow it in the next few weeks, beacuse injuries, poor management and lack of squad will kick like it does every year. why would it change, what have you seen to think times are different now than 12 or 24 months ago. same problems and no solutions, once you have seen the same thing happen over and over again it isn't hard to imagine it happening again. our salvation may come in the poor form of others not OUR good performances.

• 15-Mar-2011 14:05 | | dan
  

  big picture, there really isn't anything to show we have improved much from last year. not sure points wise where we were last year?

• 15-Mar-2011 18:00 | | CHGooner
  

  My point is ML, that the team in the 2004/5/6 period still had a large number of players who had joined Arsenal when we still had that bedrock of players. They knew what Arsenal meant to those guys and inbibed it's spirit. The bulk of those remaining guys (Petit, Vieira, Freddie, Dennis, TH10, Keown, Parlour etc) were gone or on the way out by the time 2006/7 came and to be honest the links to that era were severed, probably deliberately by Wenger (if not then he would be foolish, and that is one thing I would never accuse him of!). What has come since has been a totally different 'Arsenal'. Personally I didn't like it much from the start, but some people thought it was great. The problem is it has failed in terms of winning things, so what is it about?. Clinging to the idea that they can win the title is a bit desperate. Nobody I know believes we can despite the obvious weaknesses of our opponents this season.
  
  Anyway you want him in, i want him out, the main point is I think I am probably now in the majority ML. You must acknowledge that there are MANY Arsenal fans whether in a majority or not who no longer believe.

• 15-Mar-2011 18:46 | | redboy
  

  dont you all agree we need a tall c/half to play teams like l/pool spuds b/ham stoke b/burn bolton etc all with big forwards.They all know this is our weekness so they play high balls up to there players and we cannot deal with it (WHY CANT WENGER SEE THIS)you say we got a chance of winning the league just look at the teams we got left to play and the majority are long high ball teams and with our only 2 fit c/halfs (WHICH ARE USLESS)i dont hold out much hope of it.

• 16-Mar-2011 01:09 | | richie
  

  Amen to that! Our only chance is to keep Arsene until his in his 90's that way he'll still be around the club to have the proper influence on the successer he names. Its the only way we can secure the continuence of the magnificient Arsene Arsenal revolution.
  Well spotted Dan if our first team 11 defensive midfielder Song is injured we play his understudy Denilson.

• 16-Mar-2011 02:08 | | richie  - We Are Not Home Alone
  

  These bloggers that arrve on proper blogs spouting the "Wenger Out Crap" are invisable at the Emirate's! If I'm in London (Highbury) and for whatever reason I'm not at the stadium then I always try to watch the match with our own at any nimber of the Gooners Pubs in the area, its the next best thing to a live atmosphere.
  
  If I'm not in the country I'll still head for a Gooners haunt to see the game. Now whether Highbury or in Southern Spain either before or after the match, when much heated arguement is in progress No one! I repeat no one has ever voiced the Wenger out point of view. Do I live a sheltered life?
  
  I thought I met Gooners from all around. Where oh where does this little species of riddiculous Gooner inhabit? Because it seems to me that they are only found on blogs (For me it always raises the Question are they Spuds in disguise).
  
  Amoungst our own many will say "He" should've bought a defender.
  "A few have even said why didn't he buy VD Vart? He wasn't loads of money" Before Fabski & Cesney plenty made comments like if only "He'd" shell out for a new GK. And before that a striker was called for and another defensive midfielder was demanded. In case the once much malined and now much loved and rated Song should get injured. Some of our own Rate NB52 some don't. Loads now rate Djourou whereas at one time loads called for buys. For a few the jury's still out for Kosh others say another great AW find. Some think Abu should go others that Diaby should stay (You get my drift I'm sure).
  
  So loads of opinions, but I've never heard any Gooner say I think the problem is the boss lets replace him with XY or Z. All I hear is the mans a bloody genious where ever did we find him? And I don't know what we'll do when he eventually does go? Those are the comments I hear most . Oh yeah and that old chestnut
  
  "I can't wait for us to win something so that Arsene can prove them wrong and we can ram it down all the pundits throats"
  Thats what I hear from Gooners.

• 16-Mar-2011 02:23 | | richie  - change seats when music stops?
  

  Muk you drive me mad your last flight of fantasy was Nasri didn't cost loads of money and there are lots of Nasri's out there. I asked you to name a few of Nasri quality players out there that didn't cost a lot? As you know I'm still waiting to hear from you the names of these players?
  
  Now we have you latest "if we close the door on Arsene another will open"? So yet again I'm asking you for the door number. I don't want to have to ring every bell in the street. By the time we've done that we could be flat broke and fighting religation so "Who apart from Arsene's choice as his replacement are you talking about?" i.e. behind which door is the opportunity lurking?

• 16-Mar-2011 02:41 | | richie
  

  W12mcee thats the point "there is nothing so consistant as change" and AW has changed so much at our club there's now no going back.
  If someone can put forward the name of any manager alive who could've done for our club what Arsene has done with the resorses he's had, then somebody name him and we'll all have a proper discussion. Next up if someone can name a manager who with those constraints can take us half as far again as Arsene in the next 10 years the tell me please coz I'm gonna buy a house next door to him before he's famous.

• 16-Mar-2011 02:55 | | richie
  

  I've watched the Arsenal since the 60's Wenger is our later day Herbert Chapman. He Chapmam made us into a great local club, Arsene is the reason we have become an internationally recognised big club. Of course we the Arsenal will still be around after Arsene. But remember if Taggart had come to us without any money to spend he'd of probably lasted about as long as Brucie R. Get a grip and get a proper perspective.

• 16-Mar-2011 03:06 | | richie
  

  United's squad cost a fortune compared to ours so thats no a valid comparison and I agree many of them are only average and Taggart has done a great job in first making them hard to beat since they lost their real flair player and yes tactically Taggart is a master, but how many Taggart do you see in the league? You quote the most successful manager the prem or first division has ever known, and also the man who as manager has spent the most. Check out the figures Taggart has won the most over the years by spending the most over the years.

• 16-Mar-2011 03:13 | | richie
  

  Hardly read Desi Gunner for another great pro Arsenal pro Arsene blog.
  The tide may have changed in your mind but everywhere I go the Tsunami that was Arsene Wenger has crushed all the bring in Moronho or please may we have GG back brigade.

• 16-Mar-2011 03:32 | | richie
  

  CHG I don't know where your from but when I'm in London normally more than 6 months of the year I drink in Gooner Pubs all over Highbury & Islington and I've never heard the majority or even a minority of one call for Arsene to leave. All my old Gooner mates from the north bank in the 60's think we've got the best manager in the prem because no one else could've done what Arsene has without Big money. Certainly not Taggart or Moronho or even Daglish those being the only one who've won the prem. If Arsene can't coach defense remind me how he built the invincibles defense?

• 16-Mar-2011 11:40 | | CHGoooner
  

  Hi ML, I'm from Essex and my Arsenal pals are mostly in their 40's like me and have supported the club since the mid-70's when we were at the fag end of another manger's era. Not all of them agree that wenger should go, but from being in a minority (certainly 3 years ago) I am now in a majority amongst that group. I also read other blogs as well as yours. My original point was that the comments on your blog have become noticably more sceptical and disbelieving of Wenger in recent months Perhaps you should broaden your circle as if none of them wants Wenger out I suggest you are getting a very narrow perspective on things. Also you should read other blogs to give you a flavour of the spectrum of opinion on this major at our club. I read your blog and a number of others and i can assure you that there are MANY Arsenal fans who no longer believe in wenger for all sorts of reasons. Whether they are right or wrong to no longer believe is the essence of the debate, but to deny that we exist - and in ever greater numbers - is like denying that we have a problem defensively, or with winning stuff, or with honesty about our weaknesses.
  
  I do like the largely civilised nature of the debate on all issues on this site by the way. Keep it up!

• 16-Mar-2011 11:47 | | CHGoooner  - Sorry, replied to Richie thought it was ML
  

  Richie, maybe we should introduce our friends to each other, would be an interesting debate!!

• 17-Mar-2011 01:30 | | richie  - Perspectives from heartland highbury
  

  CHG read www.arsenalreport.com to get a wider perspective. To broarden my perspective in blogging terms I read the Gunning Hawk, and blog on it and likewise Dessi Gunners blog. I must confess I read loads of the others like a cultured left foot etc etc but I can never bring myself to blog on them because I can't be bothered replying to so much negative drivel.
  
  You are probably right from an Essex perspective things look and sound very different than from Islington one. At away games in St. James Park, Anfield, Old Trafford or Villa Park I encounter mainly the same hard core Gooners that I saw in Paris before the CL final and they aren't offering up any Wenger Out lines. No one in and around the Highbury & Islington pubs either pre or post match air your views.
  
  From my limmited viewpoint It seems that those views are only ever thrown up on a few blogs by "supporters" I don't ever encounter at the Emirates or at away games. I'm also in Spain sometimes as much as half the year and I've never come across any Ex Pat Gooners who think as you do. Then again I tend to be with other Gooners from London.

• 17-Mar-2011 09:24 | | luis zelaya
  

  it's as simple as this:
  
  if we beat United we can win the league, not certainly but we have a good chance. if we don't, then winning it is out of the question.
  
  both arsenal and utd have currently got very weakened squads, so that gives chelsea a good chance in the end, they have pretty much a full strenght team in the final run in. they could be 3 points behind us depending on the outcome of both of our next games.
  
  so chelsea need at least a draw at OT.
  
  it doesn't look too clear at the moment, wenger has to work some magic with what he has at the moment, if theo only managed to come back i'd say our chances increase substantially.
  but ferguson is in the same position, they're both on their last legs, in the final stretch, their last 10 games are less difficult than ours, but they still have to worry about the champs league, so that is a handicap.
  
  we won't be as tired as we usually are because we don't have to play every three days, so there is a real chance, but it will be close.
  either way, even if we lost against west brom, there is still a possibility of winning the league, and i would certainly have taken the position we're currently in at the beggining of the season if given the choice.
  
  i think wenger made a great job so far, but most of us fans would love to be in a comfortable spot and be ahead in the league.
  but if in the end we win it, all the suffering and anxiety will have been worth it, keep faith in this manager and this group of players, they and all of us are the Arsenal, for better or for worse.
  positive thinking never hurt anyone.

• 17-Mar-2011 11:58 | | CHGoooner
  

  Richie,
  
  The 'we're proper fans and you're not' is no argument. I can point to 14 years of season tickets, away at all the northern grounds in the 80's when it was pretty dangerous on most occasions, numerous European trips blah blah blah. i actually WAS there at Anfield in 89 btw. One of my best Arsenal mates lives in New York now and flies accross at least 10-15 times a season specifically to attend both home and away Arsenal matches. You say you read other blogs but cannot be bothered to respond to 'such negative drivel' and then say no fans have such thoughts at all. Which one is it? If you honestl;y have never heard any Arsenal fan say they are fed up with Wenger or that it is time for Wenger to go then you are not only ignoring the blogs, you are not listening. We are all fans, we have different opinions. I support the club not Arsene Wenger. Simple as that.

• 18-Mar-2011 02:23 | | richie
  

  Replying to you is always a challenge because you twist things mercilessly. I said I did read other blogs so my scope wasn't limmited to one blog but I couldn't be bothered to post on them because I didn't want to reply to the negative drivel posted on them. But blogs are blogs they ain't real people and many of them obviously aren't real fans.
  
  Personally I've never come across real people who I meet in Gooner haunts that express the Arsene out point of view. I'm not saying it doesn't excist it obviously does you for one are someone who expresses it , but I say its a very small minority of supporters (maybe fans is a better choice of word) because those who come up with it only surface immediatly after a defeat, and its not picked up by many. As I say its a peculilarly mainly blog thing.
  
  There is no point comparing scars you'd lose I'm older plus In those days I lived in Avenal Rd, I could fall out of bed into the north bank. I waited all of the swinging 60's (with the sound of the Spuds double ringing in my ears) before I ran onto the hallowed turf at highbury on a balmy night in 1970 to celebrate us doing the impossible when we beat Anderlect. The first piece of silverwear in 18 years, the first in my lifetime. A year later I was at the lane when Kennedy won it for us at the death and the following weekend at Wembley when Chaz my Uncles school mate gave us our first double.
  
  After all the promise of our first double. In the 16 years that followed when Liverpool reined supreme we only managed to nick the FA cup once at the expense of Manu'er in 79 it was a painfully long wait till we got our hands on a very little Cup (but even that was very welcome) when Judas George helped us lift the CC which back then was the Little woods. Here's my point it took 17years between 53 and 70 to win one. Another 2 followed in quick succession but then 8years between 71 and 79 to win another one. In those years we lost FA cup finals in 72 78 and 80 on top of the 1980 cup winners cup on penalties. Next up a further 8year before we won anything else.
  
  During those years when we didn't play great football through the GG years I learnt patience and I remember always that managers come and go but the club will always remains. I'm not engaged in hero worship with Arsene I have been and I am often critical. I'm not even entirely happy with the passing game we currently play. I've often called for a return to our old rapid attacking style. Nevertheless until I stop seeing any progress and until someone names the manager who'll do a better job I'm 100% behind Mr Wenger. Like 99% of those I encounter in my travels. And even the majority of those I engage with on the blogs.
  
  In 89 a procession of at least 20 cars left highbury at 10 that morning, we didn't head for the M1 we went A40M40 and by the time we'd gone no more than 5 miles to Paddington there were more than 50 cars. Crossing the north circular rd at hanger lane there was no point counting but our procession was more than a hundred cars strong and growing. Most of us didn't even have tickets, but back then those sort of things didn't matter, there was always ways around. I was never worried about visiting away grounds back then. Locally Upton Pk was more dangerous to visit than Elland Rd which itself was no day at the beach. Why didn't I worry? Well I'm now ashamed to say I would've been classed as a football holigan back then.
  
  I've been there done it and I've got the T shirts where the Arse is concerned. I don't doubt there are those who disagree and want something else. And I've never tried to stand above other fans looking down on them for their support, I don't question others support unless that support is not really support. If its unconstructive criticism then I'm against it. After Chelski gate some of our own longed for us to have our own Sugar Daddy all they wanted was a copy cat buy buy buy, some even begged for the board to approach Mournho after Roman kicked him out for playing negative shit. Imagine what a backward step that would been. But as the man said. "Eat Caviar everyday and its hard to return to bangers and mash"
  
  I know I firmly believe that we as a club could not return to play the type of football we played under GG I don't think the majority of our supporters would suffer it.

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