Written by Wenger Boy on Thursday, 16 February 2012 14:39

This is quick piece I felt I had to get out following a debate I’ve been having on Twitter this morning about Arsenal’s recent past. Quite simply, many fans were claiming that Arsenal had been on the decline for years and I contended otherwise.

I have been roundly criticised for suggesting that last year’s team was full of potential – more potential than previous Arsenal teams – and especially for suggesting that the Barcelona game was an indication of that. “It was just one game,” they said, and surely the Birmingham loss was an example of how poor we could be in the same way that the Champion’s League victory was an example of the opposite.

Fair enough. Perhaps we were lucky in the Barcelona game. Perhaps last year’s team didn’t have the potential I believed they did. We collapsed after all, and that seems like a pretty big indication of how weak we were, and this year is just a further illustration of how we’ve been falling further and further since we last won a trophy.

That’s one theory at least. But not mine.

The most complete representation of how successful a team has been comes from the league. A 38 game season gives a far better indication of sustained performance over the course of the year than a cup competition. Which is why Birmingham can win the Carling Cup and still be relegated.

Final league position is one measure of how successful we’ve been, but as we have come either 4th or 3rd for the past six years running coming 4th again this year could hardly be said to make us worse. If anything our finishing positions suggest our level has been pretty consistent for years, as opposed to declining continuously, and in any case I would argue that final league positions only tell part of the story.

Another measure of performance in the league is final points totals, and if Arsenal have been declining for years then you might expect our points totals during those years to look something like this.



But below is the actual graph showing our final points totals, starting with 04/05 – when we last won a trophy – to now.




Now to me that doesn’t look like a continuous decline at all. That looks like a period of semi-random peaks and troughs where the previous season says little or nothing about the following one.

In 04/05 we ended up with 83pts, but just the following season we ended up with only 67pts. That’s a 16pt drop in consecutive seasons, which is huge. But in 06/07 we ended with 68pts and then in 07/08 we jumped right back up to 83pts. This time it wasn’t a decline but a massive improvement of 15pts.

And if we have been continuously declining, how did we end up with 75pts in 09/10 or even 68pts last year when we only had 67pts in 05/06? In fact in every single year since 05/06 we have finished with a higher points total, so how can we possibly be said to have decline since then?

You might, however, think that points totals are misleading. If the teams around us are changing also then they might have declined themselves and it might have been easier to accumulate points. And that’s a fair point.

Essentially it’s not just how many points you accumulated, but how far you were away from winning. If 4th isn’t a trophy then 3rd isn’t a trophy and 2nd isn’t a trophy. Only 1st is a trophy.

So instead of just look at our own points totals let’s look at how far we ended up from winning the league – how many points we finished with in relation to the league winners.

The following graph plots the difference in points between our final points totals and those of the team who won the league.

But this doesn’t seem to show any continuous decline either. In fact it shows that we have actually have been closer to winning the league on two occasions, in 07/08 and in 09/10, than we were the last time we won a trophy, in 04/05.

Even more crazily, despite our massive collapse last year we still ended up exactly the same number of points away from winning the league as we did in 04/05, and the distance between us and the title was half what it was in 05/06. We may not have won the league since 03/04 but it’s fair to say that we have been much closer to it in recent years than we were only two or three years afterwards.

Conclusion

What this all says to me is that, just as every year the seasons change, every season teams change. And teams can change for better or worse in the blink of an eye. We lost Vieira one year and the next year we crumbled. We lost Henry one year and the next year we came back a hell of a lot stronger.

One year everything can click, and yet the next, with just a few things changed, it might all fall apart. And vice versa.

People often talk about building a team in terms of being a puzzle, which it certainly is. But not a jigsaw puzzle. With a jigsaw puzzle once you have a piece in the right place you can forget about it, and just add the next piece and the next piece and so on until you have the final, complete image you were looking for.

Building a team is more like trying to solve Rubik's Cube - you might have one section of the puzzle complete, but if you try and address another section you can easily upset the balance in an area you thought was sorted. And while it is entirely possible to get everything looking exactly how you want there’s not always an obvious route to take you there.

We are not in continuous decline, but rather we have changed our core players too often and this has had a massive disruptive effect on the team. In rare cases (Henry) losing a key member of the squad can even have a positive effect, provided the rest of the squad falls into place, but on a general level it sets us back and we then have to use the summer to both redress the balance AND seek to improve the squad on top of that. It’s not easy.

I am not here today to debate the issue of departures, which is one of the primary reasons why we have been unsuccessful, but just to point out that this has had a massive impact on our fortunes. In fact, given our departures, we have done pretty damn well in rebuilding our team, season upon season, and maintaining a decent, if not always satisfactory, level throughout.

We shouldn’t be content with our recent history – far from it - but neither should we paint it as continuous decline. We should view it for exactly what it is: a period of massive change and inconsistency which we are having incredible trouble escaping from.

In truth, it’s understandable why people are saying what they are. If we extrapolate from the current league standings we are likely to both end up with our lowest points total (65pts) and the biggest distance between us and top spot (26pts) that we have seen in this period. This year we have definitely declined, but while we are worse than we were six years ago we are much worse than we were two years ago, and that’s the main point.

If the decline isn’t continuous then what’s to say it can’t be reversed again? Given our history, what’s to say that with some clever changes in the summer we won’t be able to jump up the table next term?

Whether or not you trust Wenger to make those changes is a different matter, but to say this squad has no hope is to miss the bigger picture. This summer will be massive, no doubt about it, but with a few clever twists of Rubik’s Cube we may just be surprised to find that a large section of the puzzle clicks into place.

WB
@WengerBoy1

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Comments (56)

• 16-Feb-2012 15:13 | | Theopants Superstar
  

  Should change the title of this blog to 'Arsene's Vision' because it seems to me you are as short-sighted and deluded as the manager himself!!

• 16-Feb-2012 15:17 | | Rahul
  

  Thank you.
  After the drubbing, its a knee-jerk reaction to be on board for doom and gloom.

• 16-Feb-2012 15:17 | | James
  

  Total garbage Instead of reeling off pointless statistics try looking at the bloody team, the way it plays and whether there is any hope of actually winning - or competing for - anything. The conclusion you'll come up with is "NO". Your charts are merely an exercise in self delusion.

• 16-Feb-2012 15:21 | | TeeCee  - Can't believe it
  

  It's people like you, with their head up their a***, that are part of the problem at Arsenal. This squad is the worst in 15 years, the type of football we playnis both boring and ineffective, let alone easy to defend against for most teams. We play the same formation and exactly the same way in every single game. It's rubbish, utter rubbish and it's all overseen by one man, the Tsar of Arsenal, the dictator, the emporer. No-one else has a say and if you try to he'll tell you he's been in the game for xx years and knows better.
  No team has ever won the PL playing tappy tappy football. All the successful teams have played powerful, fast, attacking football.
  To let Arsenal decline to the miserable state they are in now is negligence of the highest order. Wenger is killing this club, season by season and the longer it goes on, the longer it will take us to recover when he eventually does the decent thing.
  One last point - Wenger continues to give championship standard players like Djourou extended contracts, this is the biggest disgrace of all and we have a squad thatbis almost half full of this type of player.
  Give usnour Arsenal back. WENGER OUT!!!

• 16-Feb-2012 15:22 | | Nathan
  

  Stay Goonerish.

• 16-Feb-2012 15:31 | | MeanLean
  

  Thank you for the excellent article WB.
  
  Can I just say that I will not allow abuse to come through on the comments section. I am fed up of it.
  
  If you disagree with the points above, fine. Articulate a constructive response that illustrates your view point. If not then find another blog that entertains slagging off from other Arsenal fans.
  
  Thank you.

• 16-Feb-2012 15:34 | | stevo
  

  i would agree with the notion that last seasons team was full of "potential" - but potential didnt win anyone a dime. im glad there is still optimism around but last night was a soul destroyer. its not the losing (of course that hurts) but the manner of losing (and that sadly is a killer).

• 16-Feb-2012 15:55 | | Wenger Boy
  

  Feel free to argue against me, but please argue rationally against the piece, without abuse.
  
  Haven't really seen one argument against what I've written besides that we're shit and I'm deluded. The argument isn't that Arsenal are great - I don't say that once - but that we haven't been continuously declining.

• 16-Feb-2012 15:59 | | silentstan  - continuous decline
  

  sorry but you do not know how to read graphs. Trends are measured on long term results, often peaks and troughs are excluded. If you draw a straight line from teh first and last nodes you can see the trend is down, this means we are getting worse and that top is at threat. in deed most expect it to be lost this year, which would be entirely in line with teh trend on the graph

• 16-Feb-2012 16:00 | | DC
  

  Couldn't agree more. As upset about last night as everybody else, but don't see this as some sort of the 'end of the world is nigh'. Sometimes shit happens.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:03 | | angelic beardy
  

  I disagree with this blog. This season is our weekest team and squad in a long time. Last season we had a great start to the season and it all went downhill after the loss the Birmingham. Had we had a fit Fabregas we would have won the carling cup and then our season would have been a success. This season we have lost our best midfielder and not replaced him, Ramsey was out for most of last season so putting a lot of our creative output on him is a joke. We never strengthened in the summer with any real quality and now we a paying the price.
  
  What we really need is a fresh manager with tactical awareness and can motivate the players if we really don't have money to spend on players,which i doubt we need someone with these qualities. Wenger has none, it's a shame Martin O'Niell is now at Sunderland i think he would have been a top manager.
  
  Lastly i really don't need to see charts and statistics i have a good knowledge of football and a pair of eyes to tell me that Arsenal are much waker this season than ever. The only reason we are in fourth spot is because Chelsea and Liverpool are underperforming. Next season they will spend big again believe me and we will be left behind if we don't act in the transfer market this summer.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:07 | | Anonymous
  

  If we extraploate this and forecast that, the trend will be...Wow Has Arsenal FC turned into an Accountant's fantasy!
  
  Wenger has been great for Arsenal, but it is now 7 years and probably 8 since we won a pot. Like it or not we are are in decline as a footballing power.
  
  How do we arrest this decline? Well Spurs have done pretty well recently and probably have less to call upon. Ultimately football has moved on and I agree it is time for a sea change, and that includes the board. I'm not saying averyone should get the sack but changes are needed. Ultimately Wenger will go one day and Aresnal will still continue. Maybe that time has come.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:07 | | @AllTheSkill  - Hear, hear.
  

  A level-headed and well-considered piece.
  
  Much needed in times of all "aboard the doom-wagon!".

• 16-Feb-2012 16:08 | | Danish Gooner  - Opta.
  

  Statistics,more statistics and damned lies.You cant look at opta you have to look at the individual games and they have been horrible for many years.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:10 | | jd  - humiliation
  

  I believe that there is still hope for arsenal and that we can become a better team with the potential that we have. We have always bought through good young players but mostly in teams that could already perform to a very high standard. I have no doubt that one day ramsey could be an excellent player but I am not so sure that this will happen if he keeps getting played now when he is not good enough to be a fully fledged member of the team and keeps being on the end of thrashings like the one we got last night. This applies to other players too I mean fabregas was a young plyer and turned out to be a superstar but was priveledged enough to grow in a team containing great players like bergkamp, Pires and Henry. I am worried that this potential they have could be washed away by becomming used to defeat to become a champion you have to have the right psychology and this means you have to know what victory tastes like. It must be hard for the players right now as it is so hard for me to watch them. I still love arsenal of course and will support them wherever they finish and I can accept that we won't always win, this is sport and sometimes you lose but I have always seen arsenal as a club with huge history, class and most of all pride and thats why humiliations like last nights are so terrible. I know the philosophy of the club is to bring through youth and to be sustainable and we don't have alot of money to spend but just a bit needs to be spent as an investment. We need some real class in midfield for ramsey and the other youngsters to look up to. We are being told what a difference it made to have someone of henrys calss at the club again and just spending a bit may give the new generation a winning mentality aswell as providing them with top class role models thus squeezing the maximum out of their potential.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:15 | | Daniel Wong
  

  The margin of the loss was unexpected.This indicates the gunners standing with the bookies.The latter are not to be sneered as they are invariably right 70% of the time.
  Another loss to Sunderland will generate even more intense pressure on the fm
  I don't know .A well enlightened boss will listen to various points of view.A boss surrounded by boot lickers will invariably lose his way.Wenger is surrounded by yes men who fear for their jobs.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:24 | | Wenger Boy
  

  I can't seem to reply on my phone, but this comment is aimed at silentstan:
  
  The trend is roughly downwards, in terms of total points, but not so in terms of distance from the league leaders. Also the fluctuations are so dramatic that it's hard to fit a meaningful trend to the graph. Each season is different in any case, and the fluctuations make it almost impossible to predict the following year from the previous.
  
  Also I find your claim that I don't know how to read graphs insulting. Graphs are there to be interpreted and that's my interpretation. I'll just assume you don't know understand interpretations because that seems fair.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:30 | | jumpforjoy77  - Brilliant analysis!
  

  This is one of the most sober,well-balanced,thoughtful and dispassionate analyses i've ever come across in a blog about football,in particular Arsenal football.
  Congratulations!

• 16-Feb-2012 16:31 | | Ollie  - fantastic article
  

  Brilliant article, agree with you completely.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:36 | | Wenger Boy
  

  I fear there is mass misunderstanding of my point.

• 16-Feb-2012 16:55 | | wrightydenhenry
  

  Trends or no trends is irrelevant we have lost 8 premier league games this season and conceded 35 goals how does that compare with previous seasons! In such a big game its not just about the quality of players but the quality of their hearts and minds. Understanding players' strengths and weaknesses, and planning tactics is the manager's responsibility. What other premiership team would have capitulated in that way.
  People have compained about our transfer policy in the summer but the players who could have played were Mertle, Gervinho and Santos.
  Wenger has been a wonderful manager and unique in many ways for our club, however there is an arrogance, and myopic tendency to blame others for his own failings. Without a proper defensive plan we wll continue to leak goals as we are constantly having to rotate our back four through injuries wehave known this for years it's just worse now!
  We have had a poor season so far and if we have follow previous dips in from from March onwards the decline will be confirmed.
  I am still going to Sunderland with hope for a better day!!

• 16-Feb-2012 17:15 | | Arsene knows  - Milan
  

  I was in the San siro, on the side, we were a disgrace as was the pitch, Walcott & djourou a joke & Ramsey is denilson!... Where has our arsenal gone?... With dein!
  No defence, no attack, no width, and a midfield that just passes sideways.. Your stats prove we have been nowhere for a long time, we need to be 1st! We have this stadium fit for champions but instead we are a very inconsistent team, I would not be surprised if we beat sunderland & spurs or lose 5-0 to them both! Fizman sold his self sustain model for £120m to leave us with krapkroenke franchise to invest nothing.... Usmanov or decades in kroenkes mid table is the bottom line mr accountant!

• 16-Feb-2012 17:41 | | aeroberg  - Other teams came into play
  

  Good post WB.
  
  The fact that other teams, namely Man City and Tottenham have come into play with regards to the placing in the upper region of the league has certainly made things harder. As you rightly pointed out, despite that (tougher competition) we've managed to maintain/if not better our tally throughout the years.
  
  While I agree that we're not riding downhill the speed of the bobsleigh, we have moved from having the top 2 squads in the league to the 5th-6th best squads bracket.

• 16-Feb-2012 17:46 | | Jewt  - Wenger
  

  You compare a simple puzzle and a Rubik's Cube to building a team specifically Arsenal FC team. I want to throw something into the mix. Wenger is going about trying to solve the Rubik's Cube by doing so with a blindfold, when something is not working he just keeps on doing the same thing over and over and hopes to miraculously get different results. Some pieces just do not fit and will never fit and he tries to use a hammer to put them in place. I think the time has come for the "Messiah" to go and find another flock.

• 16-Feb-2012 18:27 | | Gooner'79
  

  Great article Wenger Boy, very balanced and insightful.
  
  I have a few comments to make.
  
  1) Sadly a lot of younger Arsenal fans have grown up in a media-dominated society that can manipulate people's opinions very easily. This unfortunate and gradual development has fed this polarised "them" and "us" mentality between Arsenal fans which I believed is a deliberate mischief making tactic used by the mainstream. So as far as the abuse goes, I think this goes some way to explaining a lot of it. (i.e., young and immature fans).
  
  2) Following on from my first point, because of this extremely unbalanced and relentless media onslaught that we as Arsenal fans have to endure, a lot of fans are losing their sense of perspective.
  
  A few examples can be seen by the fact that when both Man City and Man Utd crashed out of the Champions' League before getting to the last 16, there was a muted response from the press. I must say I wasn't surprised but I was irritated, especially as the media then seem to make more of an issue out of Arsenal's defeat last night without mentioning the injury problems that have plagued yet another season, and without highlighting that Man City, despite spending hundreds of millions, still managed not to qualify whereas this Arsenal team did, yet again.
  
  Why is it that Liverpool don't get any mention? Two seasons out of the Champions' League with a possible third on the way. Haven't won a league title in 21 years. Never won the Premier League, yet I hear nothing from the media on that front.
  
  I guess my main point is that there is a conscious and rather sinister campaign to destroy Arsenal as a club and a lot of the fans are oblivious to it.
  
  I do think that Arsenal could be more mindful of this situation by re-instating it's digital TV channel to give a wider Arsenal-supporting audience more opportunities to hear the positives instead of the vitriol directed at Wenger, which is really disgusting and unnecessary.

• 16-Feb-2012 18:33 | | Jonny  - Well said
  

  Now is the time for strong hearts and minds both off the field and on it. Big game on Saturday, players need to dust themselves down and fight back with pride.
  Wenger deserves the chance to rebuild this summer but should he get it wrong next season I fear that might be the end of the road.
  What a shame we missed JW all season - he's been a big loss.

• 16-Feb-2012 19:12 | | Jack Straw  - Well done
  

  Really good analysis. Always thankful to find other thoughtful, intelligent supporters, even in the face of adversity.

• 16-Feb-2012 20:05 | | Charlie Nick
  

  If the gist of the article is that we are not in continual steady decline then the 07/08 season would indeed confirm that in as much as we challenged for the league. I have to say that compared to the 98/02/04 squads we are in serious decline. Our style has gone from the sublime to the ridiculous. Tippy tappy for 5 years and now one dimensional dross. I can't see how people can console themselves by saying that the mancs didn't get into the CL 1/4 finals or that the chavs are struggling too or even Liverpool havent won the title in 20 years. The difference is that in that time the scum have won a hoard of titles, the chavs have a few and the scousers have a couple of European cups. We have won sod all. Tottenham are 10 points clear of us and god forbid playing much better football.
  The inactivity in the transfer market seems to be excused by saying well look how much Liverpool spent or look how much the chavs spent with no result. Torres, Henderson, Carroll etc are held up as example of how you cannot buy success. What is never mentioned is that they have bought Suarez, Mata, Ramires who have worked out. We seem to be on some smug holier than thou crusade spending on Park, Chamakh or no one at all then justifing failure by pointing to our bank balance.
  The club needs to arrest this decline by bringing in experienced quality players not more bargain bucket nobody's and shipping the passengers, Park, Chamakh, Diaby, Walcott, Djourou, Alminia et al.

• 16-Feb-2012 20:08 | | Gino92  - What does it mean to be a Supporter?
  

  Amigos,
  WB is simply expressing his opinions. Whether we agree with him or not, we still need to respect him and his opinions. Being a supporter means that we are always behind the team no matter the results. Yes, we all get very angry and frustrated when the team happily bends over and takes it up you know where. Doesn't mean we need to become a pendulum swinging one way when we win and the other way when we lose. Football is a sport and like all sports, you win some and you lose some. We can play amazing football and still lose, we can also play crappy football and win. It doesn't necessarily mean that the whole team is shit. Players are humans after all and they hear all the negativity surrounding the team every day. That cannot be good for their morale. This can affect how they perform sometimes. Yes we can voice our frustrations and disappointments after bad performances but let's do it in a positive way that can critisize the team and management but can also lift them up a bit so they know that we are behind them no matter what. Saying so and so is shit, so and so is not good enough for AFC, so and so should be sacked every time we get a bad result, booing a player on and/ or off the field is just very counter-productive in my opinion. You do not have to agree with me, but that is how I see it. Every one of us thinks he or she knows everything Arsenal and can see things that the Manager does not see or sees but simply refuses to address properly. Well, unless we are Wenger's shadow and go to every meeting, every training, every one on one player session, etc... With him, then it's fair to say that we don't know shit. We probably wouldn't last a month if we were given the opportunity of managing this great club. Until such time that Wenger is replaced, we should just leave the job of managing AFC to him, and concentrate on our chosen, self-imposed job of supporting AFC, no matter what. That is what supporting means to me. Good day, bad day, okay day, Arsenal is still Arsenal. If we don't like how things are going, then we have the choice to stop supporting AFC until things change the way we want them to. Nobody is holding a loaded gun to anybody's head and forcing him/her to support Arsenal. The choice is ours and we are all free to do ad we damned well please. If Arsenal somehow manages to beat AC Milan at the Emirates by the score of 5 - nil, and move on, what then? Does the pendulum swings the other way again? We supporters are so inconsistent nowadays, no wonder the team is also inconsistent.
  
  Anyway, nothing is going to change last night's result, so I suggest we move on to the next game and be behind the team 100%, because they are down right now and they need us to pick them up as soon as possible. That is what a supporter is meant to do.
  
  Thank you.

• 16-Feb-2012 20:12 | | Paul Cass  - Graph Drawing, SilentStan??
  

  SilentStan above lectures you that you don't know how to draw graphs and then says you should draw a line between the 1st point and the last point. Ahahahahahahahahaha.
  Now who doesn't know how to draw a graph. You must have skipped that day in school.

• 16-Feb-2012 20:45 | | critic
  

  Nice to read some different perspective. Bravo!!

• 16-Feb-2012 22:57 | | Jeff Cook  - Confidence is Fuel
  

  A really excellent and considered piece.
  
  My perspective is that a teams performance can only be properly judged over a full season of 38 games - relative to others in the league. Absolute points is therefore not as important as relative position.
  
  AFC have consisistently performed at the top of the Premier League since its inception in 1992/3. Their average finish since '92/93 is 3.6 and if you only include the Wenger years from his first full season in charge then the average finish position is exactly between 2nd and 3rd - which is an incredible, and enviable, record.
  
  Of course the last 6 seasons have not been as good with an average position between 3rd and 4th - one whole place down maybe - but still a terrific record.
  
  Given the loss of four influential players; Fabregas, Clichy and Nasri last summer and Wilshere through injury - plus the dip in form of Arshavin, Walcott and Ramsey, Arsenal have somehow maintained a consistency which belies these losses. This can only be attributed to a strong team ethic, consistent coaching, financial stability and without doubt an unbelievable run of goal-scoring form from Robin van Persie.
  
  Of course there have been some abject performances this season - but also others of genuine promise and this season has seen the emergence of some fabulously gifted players.
  
  The key is to maintain a median of good form and steady results which continue to keep AFC within sight of the top four. Given the breakthroughs of Manchester City and Tottenham this season, Arsenal's position should actually be regarded as much more of a success than many fans give them credit for.
  
  Supporting your club is all about believing in them and confidence is as much the fuel that wins games as tactics and skill.
  
  If we're not optimistic - you can't expect the team to be either.

• 16-Feb-2012 23:42 | | ArsenalForever  - Some perspective needed
  

  Kudos to you, WB, for putting up a brave article in the current climate of hostility. I would have to agree with your assessment overall that, statistically at least, Arsenal does not appear to be a club in decline. However, as with most things statistical, this does not tell the full story. 
  
  Wenger himself once used statistics to justify putting Denilson in the first team, which probably influenced his decision not to buy Xabi Alonso to partner Fabregas in midfield! If you were to take the year on year stats of each of the players that have ever played for the first team over the past 5 years, I think you would be able to observe the following:
  
  1) How the club has become increasing dependent on an ever-decreasing number of truly world class players, forcing them to carry the burden of making the team competitive
  
  2) A recurring pattern whereby the club falls out of contention from all competitions in the second half of the season due to injuries to above key players (my guess is due to being overplayed) - contrast this with how Man Utd cope with injuries.
  
  When you add in the fact that Arsenal fans pay the highest ticket prices in Europe, it is not hard to see why many fans are frustrated by a perceived settling for underachievement. Someone made a fair comment somewhere about some of the younger fans taking our prior achievements for granted, but I do sympathise with those who feel that a club like Arsenal should not be happy to settle for fourth. 
  
  I also feel your second argument over how the points difference between us and the top teams does not show any continual decline is somewhat irrelevant given that all the other teams who have finished in the top 4 over the same 5-year period have all won a trophy in that time:
  
  Liverpool - FA Cup 2007
  Spurs - Carling Cup 2008
  Man Utd - PL 2009; Carling Cup 2009
  Chelsea - PL 2010; FA Cup 2010
  Man City - FA Cup 2011
  
  Isn't that the whole point? No one will look back in 40 years time and measure our success in terms of how consistently we finished in the top 4. Man Utd are still able to attract top players because they offer a greater chance of success. Arsenal have become less attractive to top players because we offer an increasingly lesser chance of success. In my humble opinion, this is the true decline we are facing, and unless change happens, it will only be a matter of time before the statistics bear this out.

• 17-Feb-2012 02:41 | | @Kipshizzle  - Thru Thick and Thin, no matter what
  

  A joy to read. Well-written and a real depiction of what we have in front of us as Arsenal fans.
  
  If I could just mention something about the Milan game: A really spiritless performance. Goals will always be conceded; it's part of the game. Milan may not have been full of brilliance or flair but they were ruthlessly efficient. I'm however disappointed that we didn't pose enough of an attacking threat on the night. Regardless of the result, we need to strive to put in a performance in every game, be it Milan or Middlesbrough, and sadly we took nothing positive whatsoever from the San Siro.
  
  My worry is that we have not fulfilled the Arsenal identity; which is an attacking one - playing quick incisive defense-splitting passes with lightning fast speed. The Invincibles set this identity and while many might argue that today's team is a slightly or completely different setup, I feel that we still have that identity to uphold, and at the moment we simply aren't. Nevertheless, condemning our manager & players as mediocre is not only unfair, it's severely inaccurate. We all know that at their best, this group of players could be a very good team. Inconsistencies in fitness, form, confidence e.t.c stand in their way and while individually they could definitely do better, I just don't know how anyone can undeniably label them substandard as a team given the little opportunity the whole unit has had to gel it's best players (e.g Jack Wilshere, a critical player in midfield, has been out the whole season; the full-backs crisis; e.t.c) I find it hard to berate the team as much as some have, yet there are other factors that have contributed as much to what they have fallaciously called a crisis.
  
  At the end of the day, we are all supporters. Clearly, Improvements are needed. Any player who plays badly needs to know that a lack of effort & hard work won't be tolerated. Wenger should also never feel that his job is secure if the team doesn't perform. Right now though, he is our manager, so we need to support him the team through thick and thin.
  
  We fall down, We get up.

• 17-Feb-2012 06:55 | | StevieW
  

  The trouble is that every summer has become massive for Arsenal. An ongoing inability to give positive ambition to our leading players is leading to a constant stripping out of talent who see no chance of even the barest hint of success with this team and this in turn leaves us with more and more journeymen players. It's becoming a viscious circle and although the statistics in this article try and argue otherwise the standard of this squad and the standard of football played does demonstrate a seven year decline. Blacburn aside, Arsenal are not exciting to watch anymore, but pedestrian and frustrating. This article is flawed very early on: on one hand it agues that the 38 game season is the real indicator of how the team has done which is contradicted in the following paragraph by indicating final league position is only part of the story!
  In my opinion there has been a lot of short-termism at Arsenal over the past few years. Influential players like Henry (now wasting away in the MLS), Adams (back of eastern europe beyond), Vieira (unbelievably at Man City!) and Bergkamp (Ajax) should have somehow been woven into the fabric of the club on the coaching staff. Instead we have a stale management partnership of Wenger and Rice. Rice was on the verge of retiring last year and the fact he didn't tells us a fair bit about the Wenger/Arsenal comfort zone which has transferred itself into performances and ambition for the last few years.

• 17-Feb-2012 08:20 | | Colesy
  

  Thanks WB for graphically confirming the decline for all to see!!
  
  I love the rose tinted view and spin you have tried to put on the resulting stats but the facts speak loudly and it's plain for everyone (a Wenger loving fool or otherwise) that the club is in decline.
  
  One day (perhaps this summer), the team will have a new manager and begin the slow process of building some creditability back into the club. We will need to invest in a squad which is capable of challenging, which has structure that helps reduce the number of injuries and help propel the club back to a challenger not "has beens" .
  
  I read numerous times on this site that Wenger's not at fault and that it's the oil rich sugar daddy culture that has meant Wenger is a GOD to have done what he has achieved against the vast sums of money being pumped into teams like Man City. That may have meant that clubs like Man City are now able to challenge at the top but it does not explain our results against clubs like Wolves, Blackburn, Bolton, Swansea etc.

• 17-Feb-2012 20:09 | | pika
  

  whoever doesnt like what is written in arsenal vision can return to his cave with the rest urangotangs and play with your black bin bags.
  
  the day where cretinous and spiteful haters will comment on Arsene Wenger has not arrived yet....

• 17-Feb-2012 13:24 | | MeanLean
  

  EXCLUSIVE: Arsenal are the only club to have lost to a smaller club.
  
  Blackburn did not beat Manchester United at Old Trafford. Fact

• 17-Feb-2012 18:35 | | pika
  

  hey colesy i hear you are president in the comittee
  
  "Apes Unite, Sack Wenger"
  
  well done lad...i guess you need a special black bin bag to carry all them medals and decorations in the meteoric rise your carreer took.
  
  
  
  p.s...when i read the word "creditability" i laughed so hard thinking it was typed by your fingers... love your humour!

• 17-Feb-2012 18:59 | | Colesy
  

  Golum, I see you could resist rolling our your "little englanders" rubbish with your xenophobic opinion again disgracing this website. ML- seriously mate, do you condone this ??
  
  He's clearly has no respect for your opinion and ignoring the numerous requests for this sort of opinion to be withheld from this site. Wasn't that why you decided to moderate comments to stop this rubbish from offending others?
  
  I guess not. You continue to allow them -even after screening. This reflects SO badly on you ML. I hope you realise.

• 17-Feb-2012 19:02 | | Colesy
  

  ML- to reply to your comment. It's not much of an argument - more a playground reply. I never claimed that Arsenal were the ONLY club to be beaten by lower placed teams - but hey, you know that already.
  
  What I did point out is a perfectly factual and responsible point. Others claim our position is nothing to do with Wenger but the fault of the oil rich backed clubs like Man City. I pointed that we've dropped so many points against teams towards the bottom of the league and questioned the argument presented by the believers.
  
  Lets keep it civil and discuss like adults????

• 17-Feb-2012 19:08 | | Colesy
  

  "will be published after approval" is the end of the statement shown in the pop up window when comments have been submitted.
  
  ML - you approve then of xenophobic comments like "little englanders" etc??
  
  A simple 'yes' or 'no' would suffice.

• 17-Feb-2012 19:25 | | Tim
  

  WB, you keep saying that people are missing your point but I fail to see what point it is that you're trying to make. If it is simply that we haven't literally gotten worse every single year then how insightful of you.
  
  Or perhaps the point is to simply advance this blog's general agenda that everyone should just shut up and be happy with the fact that we're sh*t.
  
  Either way, I fail to see a valid point here so please do clarify for myself and others.
  
  As was pointed out above, your graphs don't even make the argument for you that you claim they do. After this season you'll be able to draw a substantial downward red line between the beginning of your graph and the end of it.
  
  Tell me WB (or ML), are you familiar with the stock market? Would you want anything to do with a stock that has been mired in inconsistency and mediocracy for eight years, proving itself to be a failed business mode over and over again by continually under performing in comparison to its rivals and continually missing its targets; a company whose overall value substantially depreciated over eight years and whose value is likely to further depreciate because of missed earnings and the loss of its top player? Of course you wouldn't; that would be a dead stock, and any savvy investor would stay away. Yet there would still be those who will see what they want and invest anyway because they love the company. And that my friends, is you. Everyone else is rightfully saying sell sell sell and you're saying buy buy buy.
  
  It's perfectly fine if you choose to be blinkered but don't try and tell the rest of us we're stupid for recognizing the truths that you choose to ignore.
  
  P.s. ML, United lost to Blackburn, yes. But why stop the comparison there? Why not compare our injuries to theirs and then their points to ours. You could even throw into your analysis the fact that we're still in the CL and they're not! And that Diaby is obly a month away from returning! And team spirit!

• 17-Feb-2012 19:41 | | luis zelaya
  

  i agree, we have not been on a continuous decline.
  
  we have one good season, then two bad ones. thing is we're looking very thin in the talent department.
  
  we have wilshere, sceszny, alex oxlade. Van Persie might be gone next year, then walcott might get his chance in the middle.
  
  more talent is needed, a left back and a very good forward.
  
  fact is for us to win anything wilshere, sczesny and alex oxlade need to stay fit. by anything i mean the carling of fa cup which are our only realistic possibilities.
  
  we cannot challenge for the league or champions league, i've said it for a while, we certainly won't win them, for years, unless wenger spends some serious money, which he won't.
  
  we have a decent team, that can challenge for fourth spot, but that's about it.

• 17-Feb-2012 19:55 | | pika
  

  17-Feb-2012 18:59 | Colesy
  
  hahah from one nonsense to another ...
  
  no wonder they made you president
  
  ahaha..
  
  I see one, two, three people here putting your "decline" theories to shame yet here you are shitting on wenger, shitting on our players, shitting on mean leans site with your negativity and now you ask for his support ?
  
  top humour.
  
  ..you ..and monty pythons ....

• 17-Feb-2012 20:40 | | MeanLean
  

  Firstly Colesy, you are indeed correct. I have already mentioned to Pika about the 'little englanders' comments and the post was accidentally allowed through as I have been using my phone whilst on the go to avoid comments being held in moderation.
  
  Pika, refrain from xenophobic comments as it has nothing whatsoever to do with Arsenal. Racism and xenophobia will not be tolerated and if people fail to heed this warning will be blocked.
  
  As for the football, my exclusive comment was merely tongue in cheek. You have asked the question a few times about why have we lost to lesser clubs if it the richer clubs that are the issue. Well the answer is obvious. Teams will always lose to lesser clubs, yes we have done so more often than in the past, so have Chelsea.
  
  I asked a question recently, but don't remember a response from you. Both Arsenal and Chelsea are in transition (players for one club, manager for the other) but are in the same position in the table as us. Points and games played. Given Chelsea's investment into their playing squad and the fans favourite their HUGE WAGE BILL, how do you compare their situation to ours?
  
  Focusing more on Arsenal for a second, it is obvious that you want Arsene Wenger gone correct? Fair enough, that is your opinion. Let us say that Arsene isn't this penny pinching manager who acts as if the club his own and he is actually not being given what fans think.
  
  What do you think a new manager would do differently? Mainly in the transfer market. Example. Our wage bill is lower than the clubs who have bottomless pits (Man City, Chelsea, Real Madrid etc) what happens if for example Owen Coyle is new Arsenal manager and gets his players producing the goods and then the clubs with a larger spend swoop back in for our players again (Flamini, Nasri, Adebayor, Hleb etc etc) What does this new manager do differently than Arsene Wenger?
  
  Does Owen Coyle or manager of choice have a magic pill that stops this cycle? And also given that many like to real off a list of players not at the level of van Persie, does this new manager have the ability to have a squad full of players at the same level? Or all good enough to make a difference regardless of game time, confidence etc?
  
  These are just a few questions, I could go on about a new manager being better able to bring in quality for the money spent at this club. Traditionally we have not spent as much as our rivals, pre Wenger and today. Do you happen to know of a list of managers who have a history of finding rough diamonds and turning them into superstars?
  
  Without the new commercial deals as well as the stadium debt still being repaid, I would imagine that Mr new manager would have to work within the same constraints.
  
  This is not a 'Wenger is the only one who can do the job' this is more a 'show me the money' type of question. Open up a little, give me some examples on how we can solve these problems.
  
  We are not Chelsea, we cannot fire Arsene bring in Mourinho and hand him £300m to put us where we want us to be.
  
  @Tim,
  
  "Or perhaps the point is to simply advance this blog's general agenda that everyone should just shut up and be happy with the fact that we're sh*t."
  
  WTF!
  
  This for me is just strange. This blog is an Arsenal blog written by an Arsenal supporter. Because I enjoy the club through good and bad must mean I have an agenda?
  
  If I wrote every day about how angry I was about the players, manager and Pat bloody Rice would mean that this blog doesn't have an agenda?
  
  Please enlighten me a little more. Explain what this actually means.

• 17-Feb-2012 20:53 | | pika
  

  i did not make any ...lol ...but who the cap fits...let him wear it... a song says....
  
  i only talked about apes, caves and black bin bags...
  
  and coocoo..hallo ....xenophobia is the fuel of the "wenger out" brigade
  
  and stop wastin time replyin to those cretins, they aint even arsenal supporters

• 17-Feb-2012 22:26 | | Tim
  

  What it means is that this blog is continually making excuses for our failures, and this article is yet another example of it. I, too, came up with a whole host of excuses for about 4 or 5 years there but there comes a point where enough is enough, no? You can bang on and on about injuries all you want but when the same thing happens year after year and there's currently a club two points off the pace who has had the same amount of injuries as us your excuses become completely invalid and make us a laughing stock for the rest of the footballing world.
  
  This article is nothing more than a pointless swipe at those who see the situation as it really is: one huge unmitigated disaster. The general thesis of this article is that "although we may be sh*t with absolutely no end in sight, we haven't gotten more and more sh*t year on year, we've just gotten more sh*t in the long run. Have that doom and gloomers!" But this article has proved nothing other than that we're woefully off the pace just about every year and we're even more off the pace now than we were when it all started so, again, I fail to see the point here. Will we finish with less points this season than the 04-05 season? Of course we will. Will we finish more points behind the champion than we did in the 04-05 season? Of course we will.
  
  So where, my friend, is the silver lining here? In years past it was "well, at least we qualified for Europe again" or "well, at least we're still better than Spurs." How are those working out for us right now? If we couldn't succeed when things were relatively going in our favor (i.e. Champions League money) how in the world will we succeed now without things going in our favor? Let's face it, RvP is gone, and even the most blinkered Arsenal supporter would not argue that this team is a top 4 side without RvP. H*ll, we're probably not a top 4 side with RvP. I of course hope we are but if you put a gun to my head I'd be crazy to say we will finish above Chelsea. Just like I'd be crazy to say we'll advance deep into the FA Cup. But I digress...
  
  You tell me, how do things get better under the current structure? If we haven't been able to get the job done before, how will we possibly get it done operating with substantially less money, without our last truly world class player, without the European football or, frankly, the prestige to attract other top players? I enjoy the club through good and bad also; trust me, I still invest a large amount of time to this Club, as can be seen by my posts in this thread. I always hope for the best but have been repeatedly let down and I just can't see any reason whatsoever for optimism. Do I hope we win on Saturday and go on to stuff everyone on the way to winning the Cup? Of course I do. Do I believe that will happen? Of course I don't.
  
  Our summer transfer dealings were nothing short of atrocious and we were woefully unprepared to begin this season. Your January transfer window article goes on and on about how other teams haven't done business in January either but what you leave out of that analysis is any comparison to the other teams as far as summer transfer dealings are concerned. All those teams were ready to hit the ground running and we weren't; it's as simple as that, and now we're paying for it, as we didn't build up enough points to cover the winter months bottle job that we always pull.
  
  I don't mean to come across as insulting but, honestly, what is it that will push you over the brink to finally say "ok, this is unacceptable?" We've now fallen behind Spurs, we probably won't make the Champions League or even maybe Europa, RvP is off (for undoubtedly below the value a player like him should go for for a sum of money that undoubtedly won't be re-invested in the squad) and behind him we have nobody who can put the ball in the net, the players we need won't sign for us either because we're too cheap to pay the transfer fees or wages or because we're simply a notch below the top clubs where top players want to play.
  
  For those of you who think we're going to sign Eden Hazard and he'll solve all of our problems, you're absolutely having a laugh. If he's good enough of a player as we need to make a difference (a la Juan Mata) he'll go somewhere else because we don't pay the fees and wages to get top players (or in Mata's own words, because we're sh*t) and if we do sign him it's because he's not good enough and none of the other top clubs want him (a la Arshavin).
  
  As much as I hate to say it, there's nowhere to go but down from here, and I truly can't understand how you or anyone else cannot see that. That's why I said this blog has an agenda, because you've been hit smack in the face week after week, year after year, with damning facts, yet you continue to somehow give unconditional support this failed project. The definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over and expect a different result, well, I guess we've finally achieved that different result; we've played with fire just long enough that we're now going to miss out on Europe. But I'm sure we'll be just fine, right?
  
  I answered your question so please do enlighten me as to where I'm wrong...

• 18-Feb-2012 08:38 | | MeanLean
  

  @Tim,
  
  I cannot speak on behalf of the writer of this particular blog, Wenger Boy wrote this but as for my own articles, I do not write to make excuses, I express my own feelings and opinions.
  
  If you read my Post Milan match report then I challenge you to find 'a positive agenda'
  
  Listen, let us break this down a little and talk about pure facts. Arsenal FC is a business that owes you, me or the Arsenal fan down the road absolutely nothing. Arsenal is a business and the owner, Stan Kroenke I am sure doesn't even know of our existence.
  
  We choose to complain, support or follow the club as we want. I found one of your last points very interesting.
  
  "yet you continue to somehow give unconditional support this failed project"
  
  This, for me is why we have such a difference of opinion. As far as I am concerned, supporting the team that you have chosen is supposed to be unconditional. It is the reason why Leeds United supporters have been going to watch their teams in the lower leagues over the last few years.
  
  I do not pretend that everything is wonderful with the club, I do not pretend that our manager, players and board do not have faults but I take the club as it is because I (a supporter) has no impact on the club that I have chosen to support.
  
  Watching Arsenal is an emotional link, it is not tax. You do not have to pay to watch them, you do not have to pay for merchandise, that is our choice.
  
  You think that it hasn't frustrated me not to have supplemented our youth over the years with top quality players? You think it hasn't frustrated me that our constant rebuilding of our squad as made us go round in circles? I am not blind. I can see that other clubs have pushed past us for the short term at least, I can see that the carrot dangled in front of new players at other clubs is fatter and juicier in terms of financially but what are you going to do about it? Moan and complain until we win another trophy? If that is what you need to do to get through your Arsenal experience then that is your choice.
  
  For me, I try and enjoy the reason why I like football. The reason why I play football, the reason why I enjoy talking about it. I am trying to look at the larger picture not that I am saying you are not but from where I am sitting we have always been a self sustaining club who do not take risks. Blame the current board, manager etc, this history is there in black and white.
  
  We have built a new stadium and have had to take on crap commercial deals to get our stadium and once the debt is paid for and we can negotiate better contracts then we will take a step forward in the transfer market and wage department. Who knows, maybe the board will keep continuing to penny pinch and not break our transfer record, maybe our top earners will not match those of Manchester United who are the richest club in the world and haven't had to fork out £400m on a new stadium.
  
  Let us get one thing right here, we are not on a level playing field with Manchester United, Chelsea and Manchester City. The manager has been punching way above his weight for a long time and many have taken that for granted.
  
  You ask where is the optimism? If you cannot see the quality in Chamberlain, Wilshere, Ramsey, Coquelin, Szczesny, Miquel, Song, Ryo and many more that are still developing in the reserves then there is not much I can say.
  
  The issue hasn't been building teams, our manager is one of the best at that, the issue has been keeping these players. What is the answer?
  
  If we are not able to compete financially with City, Chelsea and Manchester United then how would you stop players from wanting to move for more money? You might not agree but previous Wenger's teams would have won the league if they were kept together.
  
  What is the answer? How do Valencia over take Real Madrid and Barcelona who trump them financially every season?
  
  Dortmund managed to do what we had done when we were winning trophies. A team built on attacking football, players developed together and had the chance to gel together without being poached by other clubs. That is because they play in a league without Manchester City, Chelsea and Manchester United.
  
  The invincibles side didn't just appear over night, they were built. It took time, it took failed seasons, it took disappointment and then it clicked. These days we haven't been allowed to get there again because money in football has gone through the roof. Manchester City were not around to whisk Thierry Henry away at 24 for £175k per week.
  
  Barcelona did not tap up Patrick Vieira continuously as they did with Cesc. We are trying to organically catch up with these teams but unfortunately this is not a short term fix, this is a long term project, a project that has seen us not be able to keep up with others on the football pitch, that is how it is.
  
  I could write a blog every day moaning at why our wage structure is not the same as Manchester City. I could write every day about why we didn't sign Sergio Aguero to back up Robin van Persie but I simply do not enjoy doing that.
  
  That is why I will continue to be 'blinkered', 'deluded', 'AKB' or whatever that is thrown at my views. I simply want to enjoy supporting Arsenal FC.

• 18-Feb-2012 11:31 | | Spectrum
  

  Excellently put, Tim.
  
  By the way Mean Lean - you talk of people being banned from this site for abuse. But pika can call people "cretins". Is that not abuse or showing disrespect to others ? Or maybe you use a different dictionary to the rest of us ?

• 18-Feb-2012 10:04 | | @Kipshizzle
  

  @MeanLean, your comments on this particular article are refreshing. I'm very new to this blog, but I must say it's objectivity like yours that I hope could be potrayed by others.
  It's not about accepting a failed project or mediocre players, because we all know for a fact that we as Arsenal could do with a little or a lot of improvement in many areas: in the quality of our players & tactics, in the levels of our determination, and so on and so forth. Real support for Arsenal - or any club for that matter - is unconditional, and if anyone finds themselves at the very least not trying to enjoy supporting their team, then no one else is to blame.
  
  I'm all for constructive criticism, not destructive nonsense.

• 18-Feb-2012 11:44 | | MeanLean
  

  @Spectrum
  
  I have already responded to Pika's comments.
  
  @Kipshizzle,
  
  "I'm all for constructive criticism, not destructive nonsense"
  
  Couldn't have said it better myself. It is nice to converse with someone who doesn't frown at actually trying to enjoy the club. Don't be a stranger to the site.

• 19-Feb-2012 00:23 | | Tim
  

  ML,
  
  Firstly, I appreciate the response.
  
  I did read the Milan article and while I'm glad you pointed out many of the shortcomings and that your overall point was that we weren't good enough, and also basically predicted a loss today, you still said "we are much better" than what we showed and that the difference between now and before is that "this time round we do not have a long list of players itching for the exit door. There is plenty more resilience around the squad so my fingers are crossed that we can bounce back sooner rather than later."
  
  I applaud you for seeing the obvious in that the team, the manager etc. bottled it on the night against Milan, but I couldn't disagree more with the notion that we are "much better than that" as besides Chelsea away and City in the Carling Cup we've played terribly in every "big" match we've had this season. I also don't see this resilience you speak of nor do I see us bouncing back ever, be it sooner or later. A resilient team capable of battling back wouldn't have been battered like that today and knocked out of the last competition we're in without a whimper.
  
  Now, moving on with your reply...
  
  You said "Arsenal FC is a business that owes you, me or the Arsenal fan down the road absolutely nothing. Arsenal is a business and the owner, Stan Kroenke I am sure doesn't even know of our existence."
  
  Let me ask you, are you ok with this? A business that owes its customers nothing!? An owner that "doesn't even know of our existence!?" Do you hear what you're saying? As Geoff on Le-Grove said yesterday, Kroenke isn't an owner he's a collector. He's also a world class c*nt who doesn't have our best interests at heart and has a track record of mediocrity and failure with all the other teams he has owned. We should be outside the Emirates with torches and pitchforks until he leaves. He's a parasite who has and will bring nothing good to our club. And if you call what we do right now self sustaining then I really don't know what to say to you. What is it exactly that we are sustaining? I'll take Dein and the Uzbek over him in a heartbeat. We've already sold our soul as a club, we may as well profit from it.
  
  As for "unconditional support," I have and will continue to support the team. What I will not do is support a failed project and a board that is systematically mugging off its supporters. When match time comes around, it's "come on you rip roaring Gunners" but when you've played 180 minutes on the week and barely created a chance, what do you expect? Do you expect me to be positive going into the Spurs fixture? Do you expect me to look forward to the fact that those c*nts are likely going to be giving it large over us at the final whistle once again? And even if we do win that match, even if we do qualify for the CL, so what? Do you expect me to be excited about us being in a competition we stand no chance of winning? So I can spend money traveling all over Europe to watch us put in efforts like the one at the San Siro?
  
  You're right, I don't have to pay attention to Arsenal and neither does anyone else, and you know what, that's what's happening. As you say, we went in debt to build a stadium, a stadium that is becoming emptier and emptier by the match. By the time next season rolls around, and Kroenke is still at the top, Wenger is still the manager, RvP is gone and our team is even sh*tter than it is now, Highbury would've done the job for the crowds we'll be getting.
  
  I try and enjoy Arsenal, trust me I do, but what the f*ck is there to enjoy about this? We're a completend total embarrassment. As I'm watching us lose again and again and the commentators are joking about who Wenger will blame for this one, how do I go about enjoying that? I want to enjoy supporting Arsenal, we all do, which is why many of us are pushing for drastic changes, because this is not enjoyable, and at the rate we're going it will become even less enjoyable.
  
  And frankly I've had enough of the money arguments. No, I don't expect us to compete in the market with City and Madrid. What I expect is us to be able to at least draw with Sunderland, at least go to Milan with an idea of how to play for a 1-1, at least be able to get the job done against the lesser clubs; things that money are not an excuse for. I also expect us to go out and buy that one or two 5m pound players when you need them for that trophy push like we did last season and like we did in the 07-08 campaign, when every single supporter and every single pundit can see we just need an extra body or two to push us over the hump, but we refuse to do it.
  
  I don't think we should compete with City financially but I do believe we should compete with Middlesboro. The profits taken by the board and the lack of investment in the team is f*cking atrocious and we shouldn't be standing for it. I'm sorry for coming at you like this but in my opinion your blog calms the storm and that is not a good thing. This season is now officially over. There is nothing to support. It's time to put pressure on the club. When the players put in a good shift they'll be well-received for it and when they don't, well, they'll still be earning their salaries, won't they?
  
  ML, like you, I want to enjoy supporting AFC, but there is nothing enjoyable about this no matter how you or anyone else tries to spin it. This club is being handled in a manner that I would say is approaching gross negligence and until something changes drastically it is only going to get worse.

• 20-Feb-2012 13:26 | | Wenger Boy
  

  Thanks for taking the time to reply Tim, but unfortunately I find the tone and the nature of your comments quite insulting. 'Then how insightful of you,' calling the article 'pointless' etc are really disappointing and not in any way helpful to the debate.
  
  I also invite you, please, to show me where I tell people to 'shut up and be happy that we're sh*t', call anyone 'stupid', or 'swipe' at anyone who claims this season is a disaster?
  
  I am not here to push an agenda, I am not here to take a swipe at other fans, however those I refer to as 'missing the point' are doing exactly that.
  
  ‘Deluded’, ‘garbage’, ‘pointless’, with my ‘head up [my] a*se’ – that’s what has been levelled at me. In contrast I wrote that others should ‘feel free to argue against me, but please argue rationally and without abuse’. Hardly a ‘swipe’ or telling anyone to ‘shut up’.
  
  Those that are 'missing the point' are not those who are disagreeing with me. If you disagree with my piece that then is 100% fine. In fact any reasoned argument against what I say I will happily consider - no theory should be believed so strongly that you are not prepared to change it if a better one comes along. But my comment was aimed at those who did not even comment on the piece, and merely insulted me and highlighted how poor the current team was, as if the point I was trying to make was that everything is rosy.
  
  Even you seem to have mistaken this article for one claiming that everything is fine. It's not. And if you actually understood the aims of the piece then you might not have used that as an argument against me. I think we are in a terrible position this season. I am devastated by our losses and I am regularly and openly critical of Wenger and the club and if things don't change then we might be in even longer term trouble.
  
  But just because we're in a poor position right now it doesn't mean things can't change. And I believe our previous seasons provide evidence of that, even if you believe the opposite - which you are entitled to do.
  
  Our decline has not been continuous. We have gone down and up and got worse and improved from year to year. This year is the worst by a distance but 05/06-06/07 was easily our worst period before this - a two year period after which we definitely improved. The graphs strongly indicate that you cannot confidently predict the following year's success or failure from the previous. The issue of 'continuous' decline is important because it implies that nothing has ever improved when this is so obviously not the case. Did I say we weren't worse than in 04/05? No. But those who say we were worse last year that we ever used to be conveniently ignore 05/06 and 06/07 when we were obviously a much poorer team.
  
  Everyone looks at the first graph and says 'well if you draw a line between the first point and the last we've declined'. But why has no-one looked at the second graph - which I think is more significant - and said 'if you draw a line between the first point and the last point we've stayed the same'? Perhaps people have chosen to ignore a major part of the evidence in this piece due to their own 'agenda', I’m not sure.
  
  People always say 'we lost players of Fabregas' quality and didn't properly replace'. And I agree. Last summer was a succession of massive errors on our part and a real turning point for me in terms of my patience with the club.
  
  But though we lost an amazing talent in Fabregas it also has to be remembered that Fabregas came good at Arsenal. He wasn't born that way.
  
  In 05/06 - a year in which we finished with 67pts in the league, only 2pts higher than our projected total this year - Fabregas finished the season with 5 goals and 7 assists in 50 appearances. Aaron Ramsey has 3 goals and 7 assists from just 32 appearances this year. Fabregas improved as I believe Ramsey will and him and Wilshere and Chamberlain and Coquelin are a cause for some optimism in my book, along with players like Vermaelen and Koscielny who, with better organisation, could be formidable.
  
  Contrary to popular belief there is still hope for the club - there are undeniable talents still developing here. But that's all it is at the moment - hope - and that's all I ever claimed it was. Unless a plan is put into action that can make the most of it then things may get worse before they get better.
  
  But I didn’t once say I believed in the current setup, unchanged, to be able to produce those results. I didn't even say Wenger was the best man for the job. I have my own opinions on these matters but you won't find them in this article. You just seemed to assume they were there, like many others who insulted me without properly reading the content.
  
  By attempting to bestow on me an 'agenda' you are exactly like those who divide people into AKBs and WOBs and cause unnecessary rifts amongst our fan base. I am neither for nor against anything on principle, but for the good of the club, whatever that entails.
  
  Also you seem to have developed a dislike for the positive message put across on Arsenal Vision which in many ways appeared to pre-determine your reaction to my article. I'd like to just point out that though I have a lot of time and respect for Mean Lean, and our views often overlap, I am not synonymous with this blog and my articles put forward are my own opinions. I would appreciate it if you analyse my thoughts on their own merit and not approach them with your obvious pre-conceptions about what I was trying to achieve.
  
  I understand that you're angry at what's happening. I am too. But it would be much better directed at the club than at me. You might even be surprised to find that we shared similar views on some things, but you were so quick to jump to conclusions about my starting position that you never even believed that could be possible.
  
  We’re not on separate sides of some imaginary fence, we’re both simply Arsenal fans who love our club and want to see it succeed. If I choose to put accross a positive message at any point then I would hope that other Arsenal fans would have the respect not to insult me for it.

• 20-Feb-2012 13:49 | | Arse2Mouse
  

  It's an interesting read, and I agree that we've changed the core group of players too many times and it has had a detrimental impact on our ability to create a side that looked likely to (which is a stronger description than capable of) winning trophies. There's so much we could bat around – the investment, the injuries, and of course the manager. But I'm running out of lunchbreak!
  
  I'd say this though…
  
  Take a snapshot of the squad now: To me it's clearly worse in terms of its abilites than at any time in the Wenger era. It certainly looks set to register the most number of goals conceded. Putting aside the stats, I didn't think we were likely to win anything last season. I knew we wouldn't this season. There's no pleasure in saying that, but the brittleness is so systemic, the exodus of the best players so damaging, that I think talk of a decline is justified. Maybe the decline is really with the manager's powers, certainly the seeming refusal/inability to countenance using any other formation, or tactical approach beyond the odd personnel tweak, is starting to seem damning.
  
  I think he'd done to be honest. It hurts to say that, but I can't see this playing out positively. Enough time has passed since the first half of his tenure to be able to say that without it being reactionary. The level of change required looks vast to me.
  
  On an odd level I admire you for keeping the faith, but I can't share it.

• 21-Feb-2012 12:11 | | Spectrum
  

  A well reasoned article ; ( copy and paste ) http://www.onlinegooner.com/article.php?section=exclusive&id=2626

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